Doug's - Guess the grade

I will take a stab at home with a higher res screen, and my own photo editing program. Please don't post the grades until later tonight Doug. Mark and I want to take a stab.

 

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I'll play:

#1 - very attractive F+, I'm mildly concerned about the mark below the S in States, but I think it would still slab problem free.

#2 - VF. I'm not a big fan of the adjustment marks, but they aren't severe enough to prevent me from buying that beauty.

#3 - Environmental damage, net VG.

#4 - cleaning hairlines, net F.

 

Oh no, another friend of Goldman Sach's.

Here's my guesses.

1. VF25

2. F12 or as low as G6= hard one to call, maybe even gets body bagged!

3. F12

4. VF20

 

I have never had the chance to really see many of these in hand, so I'm kindof going by my gut here. If I were to buy one I would really have to beef up on my research.

I did skip through the posts above, but can't really remember what the others have guessed.

#1 - bodybagged for corrosion
#2 - VF20
#3 - F15
#4 - Cleaned, but graded anyway - VG10

Speedy

 

Well I think I see another reason I don't own one of these...
Grades all over the board and with that kind of cash to spend...sheez

 

1.) I'll say VF25 thought the reverse details don't quite support it.

2.)VG8

3.)VG8

4.)Cleaned

 

Are you sure you are using the same order as the others? The corrosion I see is on #3.

 

#3 does have the most corrosion.

and PhysicsFan do you really think that the #1 is "very attractive"

 

yeah...but I just noticed that I could enlarge the pic's more than just thumbnail size
#3 does look like it has some corrosion, but I'm betting it still graded.

Speedy

 

Yes, #1 is by far my favorite of that posting. Remember, these are opinions based solely on the pair of pictures here and my interpretation of them - which is as we all know a terrible way to try and judge coins like this. #1 appears dark grey, nicely circulated with that "gem cameo circulated" look that I love. The surfaces appear smooth, with the exception of a couple small marks on the obverse and the mark I mentioned on the reverse. The coin also, and quite importantly, appears to have a good strike - which is very difficult to find on these early coins.

I prefer #1 over #2 for a few reasons (I'm ignoring the other two because they seem to be cleaned/corroded/damaged to me, and thus not acceptable for my collection). The first of these is, as I already mentioned, the color. While #2 has nice color (and probably looks considerably nicer in hand) I generally prefer the smooth, dark look. As I mentioned in my previous post, it also has the die adjustment marks which #1 lacks. Further, although #2 appears to grade quite a bit higher, it does not appear to be as well struck.

Duke, the thing with these coins is that it take a specialist of the series to be able to properly grade them. I am by no means a specialist, I concentrate most of my US studies on the half dollars. A specialist would know exactly which die pairings struck each of these coins - each die pairing has different strike characteristics and must be graded individually. The TPGs are notoriously bad at grading this type of material because they are not specialists. A coin they may call F a specialist may call VF+ because he knows that die pairing is generally very weakly struck and the missing detail is due to strike, not wear. This is just another aspect of the study of strike which I mentioned in my article last week.

 

I see your points and thank you for your comments Physics.
In lower grade coins I usually don't think of the strike mattering as much but I'll have to think about that some more.
The first coin just has some scratch's that I don't like but it does look cleaner the the others.

 

Speaking of die pairings... the 3rd and the 4th coins are struck from the same die pair... Just putting that on the table for the group to digest.

 

Ag-3
fa-2
po-1
g-4

 

Those are the prices I'd like to pay

By the way, undergrade much

 

No where near an expert on these and just my opinion:

Coin 1: VF-25 - While worn slightly flat on some of the high points I still think it is slightly better than just VF. Cleaned, but market acceptable.

Coin 2: I have seen those called mint adjustment marks. This coin is AU because of the weak strike and what little wear I can see on the high points. if you look on the obverse you see below the ear and around the ear the same type spots that I have seen on bust halves to indicate weak strike.

Coin 3: Old cleaning and market acceptable even though I do not like the black spots. This one looks like another weak strike, but more flat than coin number 2. It looks like more wear and I put it in the XF range.

Coin 4: Harshly cleaned no grade. If this coin is graded then I have a couple than need to be graded.

Coin 2 and 3 are really hard to tell what grade they are. These would require an expert to grade them. This is my honest opinion. That second coin I would not be surprised if it is a high AU coin. Just my humble opinion off what I see as far as actual wear on the high points and how the surfaces look. I can be completely wrong on these, because even looking at heritage I did not see a coin with such lack of details on a AU coin. Of course I won't learn unless I take a few lumps. Now to wait and see what they really are.

 

vf30, ef-40, f-15,vf-30, I used the ana book to grade these, I am posting before I read all the other replies, from what I have heard tpg's are more lenient with high dollar items such as these, so I think they all were graded, I have absolutely none of these so I could be as wrong as wrong can be.

 

OK then, I did some homework and I am suprised what I learned about the gradings of these coins. I believe them to all grade F-12 from most likely the same TPG.

#1 Nice coin, I like the look. There appears to be some laquer residue by the 9. B-1, BB-21, R2, F-12

#2 Nicely toned with adjustment marks. B-1, BB-21, R2, F-12. A later die state than the first pic?

#3 An obvious B-5 with the die scratch behind the top curl. The slight scratches and surface problems are not severe enough to keep it from grading. B-1, BB-27, R1, F-12

#4 Another obvious B-5. Though the hairlined obverse bothers me it won't keep it from grading. I truly like the reverse. This really suprises me but now I have seen others like it that graded. B-5, BB-27, R1, F-12

I only agree with one guess on my first post that I hastily made without knowledge of the series and grading standards for them. I've been studying them most of the day and what a difference it makes.

Thanks for the post.

 

Haven't looked at the other guesses ... #1: VF25- nice separation of hair, feather detail both wings; #2: F15, flatter surfaces, but looks original; #3: VF20 details; enviro damage/corrosion; #4 VF20 details, cleaned/maybe tooled above date.

 

I think they would all grade. I'll guess VF20 on all four coins.