Doubtful coin in auction

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by ernstk, Sep 22, 2020.

  1. ernstk

    ernstk Active Member

    I just saw this sasanian coin and I have serious doubts. Now this one I am quite confident it is fake and I am open to hear opposing opinions with a solid reason. My reason? Simply the surface is wrong it has so many holes and criss cross

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  3. GregH

    GregH Well-Known Member

    Hard to say. I'm leaning toward genuine. It looks ok for a Varahran II, king/queen/prince drachm. What makes it stand out from others is the dramatic dark toning combined with strong detail - which also makes it quite attractive. Usually these are quite worn. But I'm not a Sasanian specialist though.
  4. Herodotus

    Herodotus Well-Known Member

    A larger picture(that can be zoomed)


    Crystalized dendrites? Cracquelure?
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  5. ernstk

    ernstk Active Member

    There is a coin with very similar criss cross surface in Zeno which is condemned as fake.
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  6. akeady

    akeady Well-Known Member

    These patterns are not a sign of fakery, but of crystallisation, a process which normally takes centuries or millenia, but could be speeded up by heating. I don't know anything about Sasanian coins, so all I can say is that the surface wouldn't concern me.

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  7. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member Supporter

    Read all the Zeno posting before deciding who to believe. If the coin is genuine and heavily crystallized it should break if dropped on a hard surface but, if the metal is modern and solid, the fake should survive. I believe this it how they tried witches in Salem. I tend toward not destroying the coin out of curiosity. There is a place at the obverse top that looks like a small hole torn out. It might be interesting to look into that area of the edge with a microscope. My opinion here would be worthless.
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  8. ernstk

    ernstk Active Member

    This surface shows that it was casted and cooled down fast. when you cool down a silver coin very fast you get this surface. nothing to do with age
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  9. Herodotus

    Herodotus Well-Known Member

    Suspected as a fake.

    I viewed the posts on your link. I counted an equal amount of posts conveying suspicions that it was cast, and those differing; believing the surface condition a result of crystallization.

    That is hardly a consensus.

    I'm not in a position to make a qualified decision either way, in part due to my not being very familiar with Sasanian coinage.

    However, as a budding ancients collector, I tend to agree with my gut on such matters. If I have strong 'doubtful' suspicions about the potential authenticity of a coin, I make a conscious choice to pass. Even if the coin is indeed genuine, my own satisfaction will never be under threat, due to potential lingering second-guessing its authenticity.

    I accept that: unless it is an uber rare type, another one (that I feel more confident on) will come down the pipe.
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  10. Herodotus

    Herodotus Well-Known Member

  11. Herodotus

    Herodotus Well-Known Member

  12. Nvb

    Nvb Well-Known Member

    Doug that sounds an awful lot like the old witch test story
    Throw her in a lake - if she floats she is confirmed a witch but if she drowns.... oops ;)
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  13. Finn235

    Finn235 Well-Known Member

    Sassanian fakes haven't gotten a lot of attention - I used to think that they were uncommon until I started seeing Ancientground peddling drachms of Ardashir, Shapur, and a few others - he sells genuine coins, but nearly everything "worth" more than $50 is most probably fake, meaning that these fakes exist in the market - how many have unknowingly been sold by the likes of CNG or Roma who sell nonclassical ancients but don't specialize in them?

    Scary stuff.

    FWIW, the OP coin doesn't sit well with me. Can't put my finger on it, but I wouldn't bid.
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  14. Pellinore

    Pellinore Supporter! Supporter

    I am interested in the type (it’s a variant I would like to have), but it is not that rare. There were six or seven for sale in a few months, so I decided I can wait.
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  15. ernstk

    ernstk Active Member

    Your gut feeling is probably right as is mine on this. I would not touch such coin and to my surprise its being offered by one of the main experienced auction houses specializing in eastern coinage. So I am surprised they did not have the same feeling as us!!!
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  16. GregH

    GregH Well-Known Member

    The auction house is able to examine the coin in hand, which we are not able to do. So I wouldn't take a few opinions condemning the coin as irrefutable proof.
    You can raise your doubts with the auction house, and they will usually withdraw coin if they come to the same conclusion. They have nothing to lose - the coin can simply be returned to the consignor if it's fake.

    You are doubtful of the coin and you wouldn't be happy owning it, so it doesn't really matter if it's real or not.
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  17. ernstk

    ernstk Active Member

    I don't care I don't plan to buy a coin that I have doubts no matter how much my doubts are. So in this case I just won't bid on such coin. Let the winner figure that out or contact the auction house if he has to. I just posted to see what others think of this coin
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  18. ernstk

    ernstk Active Member

    wowww this fake was sold for 200+ OMG I'm sure the guy who bought it is so happy thinking he got a great deal! Poor guy!
  19. Pellinore

    Pellinore Supporter! Supporter

    It still is only your opinion, and you haven’t seen the coin yourself. And this is a specialist auction house.
    GregH likes this.
  20. RichardT

    RichardT Well-Known Member

    I think he might not be replying.
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