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<p>[QUOTE="medoraman, post: 3925015, member: 26302"]I view the US collecting world much more dependent on price guides, and more of a commoditized market, than all other collecting.</p><p><br /></p><p>However, one has to realize some MAJOR differences between modern coins and ancients. For moderns, every coin is supposed to be identical. In fact, if they aren't, that is a big deal. For ancients, every single die is unique. I have a coin that got listed for sale that looks just like my mother, (listed a few days after she died). I think I paid $300, (Roman Republican). I have not seen another of that die ever for sale, though you would see other examples (different dies) go for around $180-$240 nowadays and say I overpaid. Ignore the fact it looks like my mother, it is of much higher style than your comparative sales. That is the rub, STYLE. Given they are all hand made, style has a massive effect on price, one not easily judged in a price book or only looking at a Sear number and comparing sales.</p><p><br /></p><p>They estimate there are around 750,000 ancient coins "types" This number ignores most things that would create a "type" for modern collectors like mints, control letters, varieties, etc. If you included them, I would estimate maybe 4 million ancient "types" (maybe dramatically low, just lets say). Now, include STYLE, (also something that would justify a new "type" amongst modern collectors), and your listing of "types" for ancients is in the tens if not hundreds of millions. Just for the one RR issue I described earlier, since that coin got me interested in this subject I have seen at least 15 different styles over the years. Other issues, like Alex III tets, if you include style, mints, and control marks and you are talking about tens of thousands of coins by itself.</p><p><br /></p><p>Given this, one looking at sales prices of a certain RR denarii and think the prices are all over the board. Layer in all of this other information, and they become less so. Sure, sometimes you can get a good bargain, other times overpay because a person just had to have THAT coin, but I do not think ancients are as wildly unreliable as you think, for the reasons I have stated.</p><p><br /></p><p>Btw, to answer your question directly, I think price guides DO rule the US market in particular. I have bought world coins with a KM "value" of $300 for $10 so commonly so as to not really mention it, as well as paid $200 for a coin listed as a $20 coin. Most dealers here in the US would never sell a coin with a "book" value of $300 so cheap. I think price guides artificially prop up US prices. I think US prices would become more realistic and lower for collectors in most instances without price guides. Rare coins will sell for high prices, ignoring price guides. It is the common stuff artificially propped up with price guides.[/QUOTE]</p><p><br /></p>
[QUOTE="medoraman, post: 3925015, member: 26302"]I view the US collecting world much more dependent on price guides, and more of a commoditized market, than all other collecting. However, one has to realize some MAJOR differences between modern coins and ancients. For moderns, every coin is supposed to be identical. In fact, if they aren't, that is a big deal. For ancients, every single die is unique. I have a coin that got listed for sale that looks just like my mother, (listed a few days after she died). I think I paid $300, (Roman Republican). I have not seen another of that die ever for sale, though you would see other examples (different dies) go for around $180-$240 nowadays and say I overpaid. Ignore the fact it looks like my mother, it is of much higher style than your comparative sales. That is the rub, STYLE. Given they are all hand made, style has a massive effect on price, one not easily judged in a price book or only looking at a Sear number and comparing sales. They estimate there are around 750,000 ancient coins "types" This number ignores most things that would create a "type" for modern collectors like mints, control letters, varieties, etc. If you included them, I would estimate maybe 4 million ancient "types" (maybe dramatically low, just lets say). Now, include STYLE, (also something that would justify a new "type" amongst modern collectors), and your listing of "types" for ancients is in the tens if not hundreds of millions. Just for the one RR issue I described earlier, since that coin got me interested in this subject I have seen at least 15 different styles over the years. Other issues, like Alex III tets, if you include style, mints, and control marks and you are talking about tens of thousands of coins by itself. Given this, one looking at sales prices of a certain RR denarii and think the prices are all over the board. Layer in all of this other information, and they become less so. Sure, sometimes you can get a good bargain, other times overpay because a person just had to have THAT coin, but I do not think ancients are as wildly unreliable as you think, for the reasons I have stated. Btw, to answer your question directly, I think price guides DO rule the US market in particular. I have bought world coins with a KM "value" of $300 for $10 so commonly so as to not really mention it, as well as paid $200 for a coin listed as a $20 coin. Most dealers here in the US would never sell a coin with a "book" value of $300 so cheap. I think price guides artificially prop up US prices. I think US prices would become more realistic and lower for collectors in most instances without price guides. Rare coins will sell for high prices, ignoring price guides. It is the common stuff artificially propped up with price guides.[/QUOTE]
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