Featured Do 21st Century Coin Collecting Methods Drive Prices Down and Hurt our Hobby?

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by coin0709, May 4, 2018.

  1. baseball21

    baseball21 Well-Known Member

    You do realize every coin was a modern at one point right
     
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  3. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    To answer that all you really have to do is consider the name given to our hobby - it was and often still is referred to as the "hobby of kings". Now how do ya think it got that name ? It was because only royalty and the nobles collected coins for most of the past 2,000 years as they were the only ones who could afford to do so. So I think Yes is a pretty safe answer to your queston.

    OK, but that's just 1 tiny piece of data Cal and it is not indicative of the entire auction. First of all, consider the name of that particular auction, they call it the Invitational for a reason. It's because pretty much every major dealer in the country was invited. And they attended with the intention of buying coins. Do you think they went home without any after spending all that money to attend ? And yes, you can be assured collectors were invited too. But how many collectors do you think there are that buy coins with those kinds of price tags ? My point is, you can be assured the number of dealers who buy them far outnumber the number of collectors who do.

    Secondly, consider the coins in that list. How many dealers do you think there are that buy up coins with those kinds of prices tags ? Sure there's quite a few of them out there, but they also know the market for those coins and will stop bidding once market value has been reached. In other words they will not overextend themselves on any given coin.

    Lastly, read the rest of the market report by Laura. Look at how many times she mentions dealers buying coins, look at what she says about how many coins Legend bought. Then watch the web sites of major dealers, they will all have stories of coins they bought there. David Lawrence already has one up. Then consider the number of coins probably involved and think about that number in comparison to the 27 coins in that list. Each dealer probably bought more than 27 coins at that show - each one.

    I certainly understand your skepticism Cal about what I have been saying - that the vast majority of coin sales are dealer to dealer sales. But it's not a concept or idea that I just pulled out of the air. It's something that is learned after a great deal of research and observation. For example, I could tell you the story of a coin show I attended where I watched 1 single coin be sold 5 times in the same day to 5 different dealers - 1 coin.

    And stuff like that happens at every coin show. And that wasn't even on the early day - the day that only dealers and those who pay a substantial fee are even allowed onto the bourse. On early days many dealers might turn over a significant percentage of their inventory, and then it is turned over all over again - at the same show.
     
  4. calcol

    calcol Supporter! Supporter

    Doug,

    If you look at my posts on this thread, the only area where I'm skeptical of dealer-to-dealer being the commonest trading mode is for higher-end coins (few hundred $ and up) sold at auction. Although I don't have any data on it, I think you're right when it comes to shows, and good chance you're right about less expensive coins at auction with possible exception of eBay. I too have watched the extensive dealer-to-dealer trading at shows; no argument there.

    Regarding the PCGS show and Legend auction in New Orleans, it was open to all PCGS members (dealers and collectors), as well as anyone who bothered to register online with Legend to bid in the auction. Wouldn't be surprised though if most dealers acquired more coins via dealer-to-dealer trading rather than via the auction. Good chance many or most of the auction coins sold via the net anyway and not to the floor. I bid on three coins via the net.

    I know the 27 coins for which they published collector-versus-dealer info were a small percentage of total auction sales and were high-end. But auction sales of high-end coins is where I've been skeptical of dealer dominance. However, my conclusion will be determined by whatever data is made available as well as what auction companies tell me.

    I really do appreciate your expertise and think you and the other mods do a great job. Thanks.

    Cal
     
  5. EllenQ

    EllenQ New Member

    As I have collected coinage, I find buying from a dealer is much more comfortable. Of course it's possible to find slightly less expensive options through private dealers online, however I feel it's worth spending the extra few dollars to ensure that the coins are authentic and well taken care of. Established companies have a lot more to lose when their products are not what they promised. So that's my personal opinion on the subject, but of course there are benefits to both.
     
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