Featured Diocletian: Two Interesting Coins and a Legacy of Reform

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Curtisimo, Dec 14, 2017.

  1. dlhill132

    dlhill132 Member

    Curtisimo, super post and coins!!!

    Doug
     
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  3. lordmarcovan

    lordmarcovan Eclectic & Eccentric Moderator

    Congratulations on another meticulously-crafted and well-deserved Featured thread, @Curtisimo.

    I have not yet given this one the attention it deserves (have only skimmed it thus far, not read it). I'll sit down and read it properly soon.
     
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  4. jamesicus

    jamesicus Well-Known Member

    I have started a thread relating to the problems encountered when attributing folles of Maximian Herculius (Maximianus) vs Galerius Maximian (Galerius). I made it a separate thread (although it certainly has applicability here) so that it would be more noticeable to general Coin Talk participants - I get numerous private enquiries with questions relating to this subject.
     
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  5. TIF

    TIF Always learning.

    Wow, @Curtisimo! Another fantastic writeup :). Next week when I have internet I need to just search by your name to see what other goodies I've missed.
     
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  6. Curtisimo

    Curtisimo the Great(ish)

    Thank you @TIF. I'm excited to hear that you will have internet again soon so you can hang out at CT more :)

    Instead of binge watching Netflix shows like most people coin collectors can binge read CT ;) I am still going back to stuff that was posted before I joined to see what I missed.
     
  7. zumbly

    zumbly Ha'ina 'ia mai ana ka puana

    Way to go making me feel almost guilty as I prepare to wind down for the day by bingeing on some Netflix :shifty:.
     
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  8. Curtisimo

    Curtisimo the Great(ish)

    Lol there is no shame in it. I lost two weeks of my life to Game of Thrones once... so worth it :)
     
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  9. zumbly

    zumbly Ha'ina 'ia mai ana ka puana

    That’s right, ancient coin collectors are people too. And now, back to my regular programming... :D
     
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  10. hotwheelsearl

    hotwheelsearl Well-Known Member

    Spectacular.
    It's insane that his dining table is still in existence. Wow.

    That purple stone, porphyry, was later often used in spolia, where fragments of statues or whole columns were essentially stolen from their original places and inserted into walls of later palaces or buildings, in order to up the respect factor. Plus, in later years porphyry got so expensive that the only way to get it was to snatch it from somewhere else. Some sources say that good porphyry was worth its weight in gold. Ouch.

    Also, I got marked down in my Roman Art class in college when I wrote the location of Diocletian's Palace as "Spalato" (the older Italian name of the city) instead of "Split".
     
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  11. jamesicus

    jamesicus Well-Known Member

    • I want to re-visit the following coin - excuse my tardiness in not doing this sooner, but I experience great difficult in doing simple tasks such as navigating this forum and even typing due to the soreness and pain I am experiencing since I bruised/cracked my ribs during a recent fall. With that out of the way ..........

      The coin I depict here - a Lugdunum mint follis (marked LA) referred to by Sutherland in his introductory text to the Londinium section of RIC Volume VI, pages 114/115 and his introductory text to the Lugdunum section, pages 230/231 - is of great historical importance because it is one of the first Diocletian reformed AE coins (folles) issued. I have found these coins very hard to come by - this specimen is the only one I have owned.

      For Curtisimo - I want to be sure this coin ends up with a collector who has a great passion for Diocletian coinage (and the historical associations attending it). You embody that - if you would like to have this coin, let me know via PM and I will mail it to you.


      RIC Volume VI, Lugdunum, Group I, (ii), Diocletian, No. 2a

      [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Obverse: IMP C DIOCLETIANVS P F AVG
    • Reverse: GENIO POP - VLI ROMANI
    • Exergue: LA
    • 8.5 gm.
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2017
  12. Curtisimo

    Curtisimo the Great(ish)

    I would be honored to receive this fantastic coin, sir. Thank you jamesicus :)

    I am also truly sorry that you are still feeling unwell from your fall. I hope you get to feeling better soon.
     
  13. jamesicus

    jamesicus Well-Known Member

    • What happened to RIC, Vol. VI, LONDINIUM Group I, Class I? The coin listings of Group I commence with Class II. Why not Class I and what happened to the coin listings for that Class anyway? The answer is that the entire listing identified as Class I was transferred to RIC, Vol. VI, LUGDUNUM, (iv), folles, Class I (14a-21) -- the Invasion coinage of Bastien (undoubtedly prior to publication). Sutherland explains all this in his Introductory text to the LONDINIUM section of RIC VI. The bottom line is the quote of Sutherland that ".......... Bastien is to be followed in regarding the unmarked coins of Class I as an issue prepared in advance for Constantius' invasion of Britain in 296."
     
  14. noob76

    noob76 Member

    Love the write-up and the conversation. Really feel like this article should be submitted to the Numismatist. I also feel like you learn something new about Roman history every day. Had no clue there was such intact Roman ruins in Split.
     
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  15. Curtisimo

    Curtisimo the Great(ish)

    Thank you for your kind words. I don't pretend to be a numismatist (some on here surely are), just an overly enthusiastic coin enthusiast. :)

    I agree that it is really amazing how much is left of Diocletian's palace. Here are a few places I didn't show in my earlier write up.

    The Golden Gate and northern walls
    IMG_9422.JPG

    IMG_9424.JPG

    The Temple of Jupiter
    IMG_9426.JPG
    IMG_9425.JPG

    The exterior of Diocletian's Mausoleum
    IMG_9427.JPG

    I thought it was a beautiful city. One of the most fascinating places I've ever been.
     
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  16. 7Calbrey

    7Calbrey Well-Known Member

    The following silvered coin of Diocletian was struck in Trier. It has Genio on reverse.
    RIC VI - Trier 582 a . DiocGen Trier         RIC VI.jpg DiocGenioR            582 a.jpg
     
  17. EllenQ

    EllenQ New Member

    Thanks for writing this up! So informative and interesting! Which of these coin(s) do you own? And I see that you went to some of these places in person. What countries/cities did you go to?
     
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  18. Curtisimo

    Curtisimo the Great(ish)

    Thank you Ellen for the nice reply. I own the below coins and the rest are from CNGs archives (a fantastic resource for research).
    Diocletian_Antoninianus_285-6_CSH.jpg
    Diocletian_Follis_AD_296-7_Ticinum.jpg
    Claudius_II_Gothicus_AD_268-70.jpg

    On my trip I got the opportunity to visit Croatia, Montenegro, and Bosnia and Herzegovina.

    https://www.cointalk.com/threads/da...ved-the-memory-of-a-lost-civilization.303223/

    https://www.cointalk.com/threads/a-museum-that-values-its-ancient-coin-collection.305085/

    I saw a lot of cities that I only had a small amount of time for but the main places I got to explore pretty well were:
    Split
    Plitvice
    Mostar
    Stolech
    Dubrovnik
    Kotor
    Risan
    Budva

    It was well worth it. One of my favorite regions I've visited.

    Welcome to CoinTalk!
     
  19. EllenQ

    EllenQ New Member

    Thanks for the welcome and for your informative reply!
     
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  20. Bert Gedin

    Bert Gedin Well-Known Member

    Thanks so much for the absolutely stunning article of Diocletian, his palace in Split, Croatia, related coins etc. My feeling is that us "coin-talkers" benefit far more from our hobby by learning about any relevant historical background. The article, together with some fascinating photos, was a feast for eye and mind. No objection to penny-snippets as well. But such an article is top of of the ladder, educationally and artistically, and the author truly deserves to be congratulated.
    About a month ago, I purchased a small Diocletian coin, which I have treasured. It now means even more to me.
     
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  21. Curtisimo

    Curtisimo the Great(ish)

    Thank you for your very nice and thoughtful reply and welcome to CT! :)

    I would love to see your Diocletian coin if you have photos of it?
     
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