Diocletian campgates

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Victor_Clark, Sep 19, 2020.

  1. Victor_Clark

    Victor_Clark standing on the shoulders of giants Dealer

    Here are two of the new additions to my collection.

    the first one is a VICTORIAE SARMATICAE with eagles on the turrets


    A.D. 295
    AR Argenteus
    19mm 3.3g
    DIOCLETIANVS AVG; laureate head right.
    VICTORIAE SARMATICAE; four turreted camp-gate, open, with doors thrown back; each turret surmounted by facing eagle.
    In ex. SMNΓ
    RIC VI Nicomedia 22a

    and the second is an unofficial issue.

    unofficial Diocletian.jpg

    circa A.D. 295
    DIOCLETIANVS AVG; laureate head right.
    VIRTVS MILITVM; four tetrarchs sacrificing over tripod before gate in six turreted enclosure.
    in exergue [?]

    the above coin is copying something like this --

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  3. ominus1

    ominus1 Well-Known Member

    wow!..never seen any of those..kool Vic...:)
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  4. ancient coin hunter

    ancient coin hunter I dig ancient coins...

    Nice argentei Victor.
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  5. Romancollector

    Romancollector Well-Known Member

    Great additions!!! I've always liked the portraits from Nicomedia on argentei because of they remind me (style wise) of the portraits of the tetrarchs in Venice.
  6. Gavin Richardson

    Gavin Richardson Well-Known Member

    Man. Eagles on the turrets. That’s a pretty fantastic detail.
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  7. Bing

    Bing Illegitimi non carborundum Supporter

    The open door coin is fantastic

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    Stunning examples, @Victor_Clark.
    ...Um, not sure of the relevance, but in @JayAg47's thread, My First Siliqua!, I got into how the architectural motif on the reverse of your last three (of which @seth77 had another impressive example) is echoed in manuscript illustrations of the Carolingian and late Anglo-Saxon periods. Namely the Utrecht Psalter, c. early or mid-9th c., and the early 11th-c. copy, the Harley Psalter. Not sure if the links will go directly to the leaf in question, but the first one that jumps out, in both cases, is Folio 5 recto, above the beginning of Psalm 9:
    It's easy to speculate that, as a kind of visual meme, the architectural motif would have found its way onto late Classical manuscripts. Which, in turn, would be the 'go-to' inspiration during the Carolingian Renaissance. Both manuscripts demonstrate a lot of this kind of neo-classical, quasi-aerial perspective. Too bad that was effectively lost over succeeding centuries.
    ...With thanks to @seth77 for prodding me to actually find examples of what I was otherwise yammering about off the top of my head.
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2020
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  9. seth77

    seth77 Well-Known Member

    The Utrecht Psalter is a beauty.

    Thou that liftest me up from the gates of death, that I may declare all thy praises in the gates of the daughter of Sion.

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  10. Al Kowsky

    Al Kowsky Supporter! Supporter

    Victor, Does "unofficial" on the slabbed argenteus mean counterfeit or barbarous o_O?
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  11. Victor_Clark

    Victor_Clark standing on the shoulders of giants Dealer

    It can mean either...I think the big difference is intent. Was it meant to deceive or minted for other reasons, like shortage. This one, though, is what many would call "barbarous" but I prefer the term unofficial; especially as many barbarous coins are actually pretty good in style, so not barbarous at all.
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  12. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    Insightful (and Cool) observation, @Romancollector. ...Is it the Arch of Constantine that appropriated c. 2nd-c. reliefs from someone else's, which provide instant, glaring contrast to the contemporaneous ones on the same arch?
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  13. Romancollector

    Romancollector Well-Known Member

    Yes I believe it incorporated reliefs that date to the reigns of Trajan, Hadrian and Marcus Aurelius. I've taken one too many Roman history/art/architecture courses, and this arch is frequently discussed to demonstrate the trend of using spolia in late antiquity.
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  14. Ancient Aussie

    Ancient Aussie Supporter! Supporter

    Love that open door camp gate, I can't recall seeing any better.
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  15. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    Thanks, @Romancollector. Just from, what, maybe (Stand Back: ) 200-level courses in Art History, this was already something on the academic agenda. In terms of spolia, per se? Not so sure.
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  16. Alegandron

    Alegandron "ΤΩΙ ΚΡΑΤΙΣΤΩΙ..." ΜΕΓΑΣ ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΣ, June 323 BCE Supporter

    I like the UNOFFICIAL the best of the three! It has a very distinctive look that I enjoy. Congrats, @Victor_Clark .
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  17. zumbly

    zumbly Ha'ina 'ia mai ana ka puana Supporter

    Both are great! I've been wanting one with the eagles on the turrets. Here's my Maximianus VICTORIAE SARMATICAE from the same officina, but without the eagles.

    Maximianus - Argenteus Victoriae Sarmatica 2326 b.jpg
    AR Argenteus. 3.11g, 17.9mm. Nicomedia mint, circa AD 295-296. RIC VI Nicomedia 25b; RSC 553c. O: MAXIMIANVS AVG, laureate head right. R: VICTORIAE SARMATICAE, campgate with four turrets, doors open, and star above archway; SMNΓ in exergue.
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  18. Victor_Clark

    Victor_Clark standing on the shoulders of giants Dealer

    thanks all...I am looking forward to getting the unofficial campgate and busting it out of the slab.
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