Did NGC blow it on this one?

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by NSP, Sep 5, 2016.

  1. NSP

    NSP Well-Known Member

    While looking through listings for fun, I came across what is supposedly an 1822 JR-1 dime that NGC graded G4. Its certification lookup is here: https://www.ngccoin.com/certlookup/2676316-012/

    Compare that to the ones on PCGS's Coinfacts website: http://www.pcgscoinfacts.com/Coin/Detail/4497

    Notice how the coins don't match up, particularly the dates, but other things like star and letter placements too. And it's not like the NGC coin and the Coinfacts coins are different varieties, as there is only one 1822 variety. Given this information, I think the NGC coin is an 1832.

    This is slightly problematic because a G4 1832 is worth about $30 and a G4 1822 is worth about $2000... so I feel for whoever purchased this as an 1822.

    What do you all think?
     
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  3. Eduard

    Eduard Supporter**

    I fully agree, the coin in the NGC slab is definitely not an 1822.
    This is quite a mistake to make, but possibly is only a typo.
     
  4. NorthKorea

    NorthKorea Dealer Member is a made up title...

    NGC would claim it's not covered under their policy, as the coin is clearly not an 1822.
     
  5. Conder101

    Conder101 Numismatist

    It's an 1832 JR-2
     
  6. SuperDave

    SuperDave Free the Cartwheels!

    Were you looking at an auction listing? It'd be a gentlemanly thing to let the auctioneer know if so.
     
    NSP and Seattlite86 like this.
  7. fish4uinmd

    fish4uinmd Well-Known Member

    What about a counterfeit slab?
     
  8. NSP

    NSP Well-Known Member

    It's on someone's fixed price list, so I'll go ahead and let them know.
     
  9. messydesk

    messydesk Well-Known Member

    A counterfeit slab wouldn't show up on NGC's cert verification. They screwed the pooch on this one, and will probably say it's a clerical error, since it's so obvious.
     
  10. fish4uinmd

    fish4uinmd Well-Known Member

    OK, how can be sure that the actual coin is NOT an 1822?
     
  11. messydesk

    messydesk Well-Known Member

    Size of the date and diameter of the coin. In both cases, the 1822 is larger.
     
    NSP, micbraun and fish4uinmd like this.
  12. fish4uinmd

    fish4uinmd Well-Known Member

    Thanks.
     
  13. NorthKorea

    NorthKorea Dealer Member is a made up title...

    I emailed NGC, so we'll see what their response is.
     
  14. Treashunt

    Treashunt The Other Frank

  15. mikenoodle

    mikenoodle The Village Idiot

    It is possible that NGC would re-holder the coin into a correct slab if for no other reason than to correct the record, protect their reputation and to correct their population report.
     
  16. baseball21

    baseball21 Well-Known Member

    All the top services will reholder label mistakes for free, the only question is whether or not there is any guarantee if you paid for the wrong label
     
  17. NorthKorea

    NorthKorea Dealer Member is a made up title...

    The guarantee doesn't apply to typographical errors. If the buyer didn't know the coin was a 1832, they can return it to the seller.
     
  18. NSP

    NSP Well-Known Member

    Update: I emailed the dealer and they replied that upon closer examination they still think it's an 1822 dime. I politely emailed them back with a link to this thread, and they didn't respond. The coin is still for sale as an 1822 on their website. Talk about an upstanding dealer....
     
  19. SuperDave

    SuperDave Free the Cartwheels!

    This would be where you "out" the dealer in public, then. It's easily seen even in the small NGC cert images, and immediately apparent to anyone who knows how to attribute coins. Heck, with the large denticles of the 1822, it's not even possible for the first star to be that far away from the bust, much less any of the other plain pickups.
     
  20. NorthKorea

    NorthKorea Dealer Member is a made up title...

    NSP likes this.
  21. messydesk

    messydesk Well-Known Member

    Well, you might want to get NGC involved. The dealer has a big NGC logo on their site, presumably because they're an authorized NGC dealer, and they're misrepresenting a mechanical error by NGC, which should be a violation of some sort of terms of their authorized dealer agreement. NGC, upon seeing this thread and the coin in question, will probably also pull the cert so that it won't verify and urge the dealer to send the coin for correction.
     
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