Denarius of Vitellius pickup

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Gam3rBlake, May 6, 2022.

  1. Gam3rBlake

    Gam3rBlake Well-Known Member

    This is definitely, by far, the worst condition coin in my ancients collection AND it has bankers marks..

    Even worse is the fact that I accidentally sent my bid way too high and ended up paying twice as much as I should have :(.

    But at the same time if I want all the Emperors I need Vitellius and his decent condition denarius is very expensive.

    Plus this reverse is particularly rare for an already pretty rare Emperor. Normally Vitellius has Vesta on the reverse of his denarius and I think it’s cool that this one has Vitellius’ own ancestor on the reverse.

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    Vitellius (late April-20 December AD 69). AR denarius (18mm, 2.94 gm, 5h). NGC VG 4/5 - 3/5, bankers mark. Rome. A VITELLIVS GERM IMP AVG TR P, laureate head of Vitellius right / L VITELLIVS COS III CENSOR, laureate, draped bust of Lucius Vitellius right; scepter surmounted by eagle to right. RIC I 77.

    Feel free to share your Vitellius denarii here if you got ‘em :).
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2022
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  3. Andres2

    Andres2 Well-Known Member

    Probably the same grade VG for my Vitellius
    bought it also for my 12 Caesar set

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    Eduard, Limes, ancient times and 13 others like this.
  4. John Conduitt

    John Conduitt Well-Known Member

    If that's your worst by far, you have a lot of scope for the other emperors you need! I like banker's marks as long as they're not right across the face. Sometimes, even then I like them.

    Vitellius Denarius, 69
    upload_2022-5-6_23-9-56.png
    Rome. Silver, 20mm, 3.1g. Laureate head; A VITELLIVS GERMAN IMP TR P. Victory seated left, holding patera in right hand and palm branch in left, no legend (RIC 88). From the Westbury Sub Mendip Hoard 2016.

    Edit: CNG sold an RIC I 77 for $2970 + fees in 2008. It's good VF but with 'smoothing and porosity', which makes your $600 including fees 14 years later sound good https://www.cngcoins.com/Coin.aspx?CoinID=127591
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2022
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  5. Gam3rBlake

    Gam3rBlake Well-Known Member

    Honestly I wouldn’t mind so much if I hadn’t accidentally set my maximum reserve bid way too high because I had a brain fart. :(

    I meant to set my max bid at $300. :(

    I won it today and I haven’t even gotten my invoice for it yet and I’m having trouble enjoying the coin knowing I overpaid by so much.
     
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  6. The Meat man

    The Meat man Supporter! Supporter

    The bid error is a bummer. Still, it's a decent coin, and pretty rare to boot.

    I've got a different A.D. 69 Emperor's denarius coming in the mail that will make yours look like a MS 5/5.
     
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  7. Gam3rBlake

    Gam3rBlake Well-Known Member

    Maybe if I pass it down to my kids and grandkids eventually it will be worth what I paid for it. I’m too embarrassed to even say what I actually ended up paying even if it was an accident. o_O

    As for the condition: I would say my coins are about in this condition on average.

    It’s not MS but still pretty decent.

    CCA1D016-FB2D-4395-A654-F0F8373D8D7C.jpeg
     
  8. Gam3rBlake

    Gam3rBlake Well-Known Member

    Oh hey I found the exact same type of coin as the one I got! :)

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  9. Mat

    Mat Ancient Coincoholic

    Wonderful addition, congrats.

    [​IMG]
    Vitellius (69 A.D.)
    AR Denarius
    O: A VITELLIVS GERMAN IMP TR P,Laureate head right.
    R: S P Q R / OB / C S in three lines within wreath.
    Rome Mint, 69 A.D.
    3.15g
    18.5mm
    RIC I 83; RSC 86.
    [​IMG]
    Vitellius (69 A.D.)
    Egypt, Alexandria
    Billon Tetradrachm
    O: ΩΛΟΥ ΟΥΙΤ ΚΑΙΣ ΣΕΒ ΓΕΡΜ ΑΥΤ, laureate head right.
    R: Nike advancing left, holding wreath with her extended right hand and palm frond with her left; LA (date) to left.
    26mm
    12.1g
    RPC 5372; Köln 260-2; Dattari 340; K&G 19.1. Emmett 196.1
     
  10. Gam3rBlake

    Gam3rBlake Well-Known Member

    Thanks :). I imagine his extremely short reign is the reason for the lack of relatively few surviving examples of his coinage.
     
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  11. Gam3rBlake

    Gam3rBlake Well-Known Member

    Is there any way to date bankers marks?

    If the one one my coin was done thousands of years ago it would make the coin even cooler from a historical perspective.

    But if it was done in modern times to determine authenticity it’s just sad :(.
     
    Edessa likes this.
  12. DonnaML

    DonnaML Well-Known Member

    I personally think your coin is quite appealing despite its VG condition. The banker's mark wouldn't bother me in the least.

    My Vitellius wouldn't grade much higher, if at all, I believe. But I wanted one on which his name is legible, and it is -- as is yours.

    Vitellius AR Denarius, Jul 18-Dec 69 AD, Rome Mint. Obv. Laureate head right, A VITELLIVS GERM IMP AVG TRP / Rev. Tripod-lebes (cauldron) surmounted by dolphin lying right on top, with raven standing right below, XV VIR SACR FAC. RIC I 109, RSC II 111 (ill.), Sear RCV I 2201 (ill.), BMCRE 39. 18.5 mm., 3.1 g. [See Sear RCV I at p. 421, explaining that the reverse “refers to Vitellius’ membership in the priestly college of the Quindecimviri Sacris Faciundis, ‘fifteen men for the conduct of sacred matters.’ This body had care of the Sibylline prophecies and were famous for the opulence of their banquets ,a feature of the priesthood which particularly appealed to the gluttonous emperor.]

    [​IMG]

    One reason I haven't tried buying an Otho yet is that his coins are even more expensive -- at least $500 or more for examples that would be lucky to qualify as VG! The choice is between that and Roman Provincials with portraits that don't resemble Otho's Imperial portraits at all.
     
  13. Gam3rBlake

    Gam3rBlake Well-Known Member

    Honestly if I hadn’t messed up my bid I would be totally happy with this coin.

    But Heritage had a big auction of ancients today and I was looking at three coins. This one, a VG Caesar and an AU Nero.

    I got this one mixed up with the VG Julius Caesar denarius when I was bidding and accidentally bid on it as if it was the VG Caesar only to realize I got the two mixed up.

    It was the Caesar portrait denarius too not the elephant one.

    But I definitely won’t make that mistake again and in the end at least this coin has a decent portrait and one of the rarer reverse types and the fact it’s a portrait on the reverse is like a two for one.

    It definitely works as a specimen of Vitellius for my All the Emperors denarii collection though so there is a silver lining :)
     
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  14. Gam3rBlake

    Gam3rBlake Well-Known Member

    Oh wow look at this!! O_O

    I had no clue it was THAT rare to the point that even the British Museum doesn’t have one.

    The British Museum has an insane collection with legendary coins like the gold Eid Mar aureus of Brutus.

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  15. DonnaML

    DonnaML Well-Known Member

    We all make mistakes! How much did the VG Caesar sell for, out of curiosity?
     
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  16. Gam3rBlake

    Gam3rBlake Well-Known Member

    I believe it sold for like $810 if I recall correctly.
     
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  17. Mat

    Mat Ancient Coincoholic

    Is there a pic you can post? Sounds like that was a deal.
     
  18. DonnaML

    DonnaML Well-Known Member

    It does, although I don't know how much one has to add for the buyer's fee. Still, even a total close to $1,000 would probably be a bargain.
     
  19. Gam3rBlake

    Gam3rBlake Well-Known Member

    I’m not sure how to find it because when I lost it I untracked it.

    But this one sold not long ago for $1080 so it’s not too big of a deal.
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  20. Gam3rBlake

    Gam3rBlake Well-Known Member

    Just curious if you guys had to choose between banker’s marks and a different problem like scratches, cleaning, holed etc., which is worse?
     
  21. octavius

    octavius Well-Known Member

    I think you did rather well with your coin. It is very rare and it has nice even wear with a full legend, and two portraits of two important historical figures.
    here is my Vitellius, not as rare...


    3k9DbW775pxLxZ2qt9zA8jCrdT4dMs.jpg STp5L8TnExz27ZekJa4bw6aQ9qXqfG.jpg
     
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