Deceitful Ebay Sellers (what to look out for)

Coin Facts also lists several - http://www.coinfacts.com/colonial_coins/nova_constellatio/nova_constellatio_coppers.htm

The main things about the ebay coin are: It doesn't appear to be copper. The orentation of the eye in relation to the word NOVA is 90 degrees off all the actual examples. The coin has a general rough look, especially the beading around the rim on the obverse (see above the "C" and the "LA").

The seller states that "... electrolytes do exist." I guess that is his way of saying that this MIGHT be a copy.

 

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No!

It couldn't possibly be a copy!

Ribbit

 

Here's the seller's reply on the interesting Nova Constellatio:

"The book is the Official Red Book of United States Coins 2004 and it is on page 35."

If anyone has that copy, please look it up and tell us what it says? :thumb:

Ribbit

 

I am afraid that the California Fractional may actually be a brass reproduction that was minted in the sixties. I say this because I once bought a very small one .0125 Troy OZ (that's right 1/80 of a Troy Ounce) from a friend at spot, so I only had a few buck in it, and guess what it was one of the repros. I threw it out once I found out. We never know how long we'll be on this planet and I didn't want it in my collection.
The executor to my will would have lost all credibility to whomever was appraising my estate. Plus if it isn't real, it has no collecting appeal to me. I don't know why anyone would purposely buy a repro as they do on Ebay. Which brings up another thought, have you ever noticed how small the wording on some of their ads are, that they are repros, not an actual coin, and that the wording is hidden amomgst a vast amount of text. They also do not identify the repro in the headline, so time is waste on looking at the ads. I do not believe those ads should be allowed on Ebay and certainly not in the same category as real coins.
Vegas Vic

 

I think Ebay should require Reproductions to be listed in the Repro Section and make it a violation to list them in any other section. That would create a "Separation of States" between Authentic & Counterfeits.

Ribbit

 

For what it's worth (HAH!) ebay does have a specific written policy governing the listing and sale of copies. Explained here - http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/selling-coins.html and http://pages.ebay.com/coins_code_of_conduct/

These reference the ANA and imply that the ANA and ebay have a relationship. Maybe reporting fraudulent listings should go through the ANA?

If not, you can at least contact ebay at http://contact.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAP...Listing+Policies+for+Sellers+>+Selling+Coins+ , or call their customer service to report listing violations

 

What you guys are missing on the Nova Constellatio piece is that you are looking at the coppers that were actually issued for circulation. The eBay piece is a modern copy of one of Govenour Morris's pattern pieces from his original coinage proposal where he proposed to divide the Spanish milled dollar into 1440 "units" because by doing that it was possible to rapidly convert prices into twelve of the thirteen colonies official "money of account". He had patterns produced in England to illustrate his new coinage idea in denominations of 1000 units (two different reverse designs), 500, 100 and 5 units. (one of the 1000 and the 5 unit coins are unique. For a long time all but the 5 units were known and John J Ford had the rest of the set. Then the 5 unit turned up in England in I believe 1982 and Ford reassembled the set for the first time since 1783.)

 

Novo Costellatio

In my post #61 I gave reasons why I thought the ebay coin wasn't on the up and up. I have since found reference to the pattern Novos and it seems the coin in question does resemble one of the pattern coins. It's still almost certainly a reproduction but it would have cost $1000 to find out (the coin didn't sell).

 

I did the same thing. I ran across it in Breen's Encyclopedia and carefully compared the two and emailed the seller and told him it was a copy. I also told him to examine the pic of the one in the Redbook (bought one today) to see the differences himself.

There's an old saying - Can't see the trees for the forest! - which may come into play and it's also known as Tunnel Vision. You "acquire" something like that and soooo want it to be the real deal, that you overlook the obvious thing - it's a counterfeit. That same concept is used by sellers when they use the Power of Suggestion to get a buyer to see something that isn't there, for example - "While it's hard to make out the date, the last digit is a 9 and the only one that can be, is a 1799." (see 1799 DBC auction earlier in this post) or how about the no date large cent auction earlier, where he "thinks" one is a Flowing Hair Cent and another is a Capped Bust Cent, when, more than likely, they were all no-date Draped Bust Cents and worth a couple of dollars each but someone paid a nice amount for them HOPING to finally own a Flowing Hair Cent and/or Capped Bust Cent.

Ribbit

 

Auction wording has kept many ebay con men out of real trouble.

The "Xbox box" was an empty box that at one time contained a game system

Can't forget the P-P-P-Powerbook...actually that was a reverse scam and the bad guy got hosed.

And my personal favorite, <b>Toshiba A30 Satellite Laptop</b>, blah blah blah, Last line read "You are bidding on a picture of my laptop"

 

Here's another interesting auction:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=350086191877&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=022

It's a 1864 2 Cent being listed as a Small Motto but it's a Large Motto. I messaged the seller but after a day of giving them time to reply, not a peep out of them. It's clear by the bids (2 bidders) that 2 people have bought the description but if the seller doesn't correct the listing and inform the bidders of the mistake, I don't know what I can do about it until the end of the auction, by contacting the winning bidder and letting them know they've been duped but the seller will probably offer it to the other bidder and I won't know who they are.

What can be done to stop this from occurring on this auction and other similiar auctions? :headbang:

Ribbit

 

I've read every all of your posts and the one thing none of you really hit on is the fact that if the seller doesn't offer a full 100% guarantee, no question's asked, then everything else is irrelevant. If you are willing to bid and take a chance without doing your homework(reading) doesn't that lay blame on you as well? Ignorance is a two way street! I certainly agree that ebay should start a seperate category for repro's or Copy's but what is the likeliness of that happening? And another thing no one referenced is all of the sellers selling "Unsearched" lots. If any of you buy that I have some Ocean front property in Arizona I'd like to sell you! Bidding will start at .99 and will have NO RETURNS.
I have just recently had the first and worst experience on ebay with a seller that claimed to include Insurance in the S&H but when the coins never showed up(and still have not arrived), ebay was extremely helpful in resolving the situation. The seller went as far as to not only threaten my life but my entire families as well, all over a 75.00 deal. He even went as far as to promise me a bomb in the mail, but if he sends it the same way he sent the coins I'll live a very long natural life!
But needless to say he is no longer a member on ebay even after trying to come back under a different name so my hats off to ebay and I personally think they do try their best to make it a excellent place to do business. With that said the buyer's still hold a certain amount of accountabilty for their actions as well.

Never argue with a fool because he is certain to bring you down to his level and beat you with experience every time...

 

How many are available, what's the price for shipping, and will you ship worldwide?

Ribbit

Ps: Will you drop ship? I would love to gift one to Spock for his Christmas prezzie :hug: and I know Doug needs a seaside retirement spot, after putting up with all of us. :goofer:

 

They are 1 acre lots, Dutch of coarse, and sorry no International shipments. Shipping is free but handling is extra. The good news is the more you buy the better the price on handling. Drop shipment will be pending on the results of the upcoming Presidential race outcome? How many should I put you down for?

 

3:

1 for Spock
1 for Doug
1 in between for me, so they will be my neighbors.

Yepper Doug & Spock, won't you be my . . . won't you be my . . . won't you be my neighbor! Doug can make the margaritas, Spock can man the fans, and I'll keep the water warm. :mouth:

Ribbit

 

I would say done but the part about you keeping the water warm concerns me...

 

No just one. Bidder 1 dropped out at $8 and I would very happily pay $8 for a large motto in that condition.

Did he make the mistake of putting that in writing? (snail or email) If so send it to the postmaster and ask them to check into it. They will take it seriously since he has not only just threaten you but he has also threaten the life of every postal worker who might come in close contact with such a package. The postal workers may no longer be federal workers but they do still tend to treat them as such. What he has done is considered a serious crime and he would at least get a nice interview with couple of unfriendly law enforcement types.

 

Actually they have separate sections for reproductions listed under Ancients, Exonumia, and paper money.

 

I've read every all of your posts and the one thing none of you really hit on is the fact that if the seller doesn't offer a full 100% guarantee, no question's asked, then everything else is irrelevant. If you are willing to bid and take a chance without doing your homework(reading) doesn't that lay blame on you as well? Ignorance is a two way street! I certainly agree that ebay should start a seperate category for repro's or Copy's but what is the likeliness of that happening? And another thing no one referenced is all of the sellers selling "Unsearched" lots. If any of you buy that I have some Ocean front property in Arizona I'd like to sell you! Bidding will start at .99 and will have NO RETURNS.
as stated by PennyLuvr
I agree totally that ignorance is a two-way street. However, when one of the parties is operating to defraud then it is not ignorance you are battling, it is a knowledgeable person using their knowledge to gain an upperhand as the buying party is expecting an honest transaction.
By the way, I a very upset message this morning from an Ebay user you I had a bad exoerience with an left a feedback reflecting that. He will be even more upset when he reads my reply. I told him I had found his Ebay ID in the CT forum on deceitful users. I would love to see his face when he finds out he has been "outed" and any member of this forum has knowledge of his dealings.
You just gotta love the Internet and power that the knowledge available has brought.
Vegas Vic

 

If you will look at the bidding history, only 2 peeps bid and bidder 2, which won it, bid 3 times and the reason she bid 3 times is because bidder 1's opening bid was above 90 pounds and bidder 2 bid 60, then 80, then 99 pounds and her 3rd bid finally overtook bidder 1's opening bid.

There was NEVER a bid for 8 dollars.

Ribbit

Ps: I happen to know the winning bidder so I will message her and fill her in on what she bought.