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Message:: [QUOTE="baseball21, post: 3316272, member: 76863"]Academic discussions require intellectual honesty and a worthy topic, this topic misses on both marks.  Dan Carr and CAC are the two topics were supposedly intelligent people go off the rails the most. Trying to pretend that the ANA opinion wouldn't hold significant weight in court or that it is meaningless is not being intellectually honest, neither is just dismissing it like it's am equal to opinions being put forth by others.  Trying to pretend that it doesn't matter that it has been essentially a decade with not even so much as a knock it off letter like that means nothing is not being intellectually honest. If it was 2012 there could have been an academic discussion, it's 2019 with multiple dismissed complaints and people still literally saying the same things as 7 years ago because they feel that's how it should be or that's how they want it to be. The academic value of any of this ended half a decade ago, it's time to start accepting the facts.  Some at least have the intellectual honesty to say things like "I wish", "I feel", "I would rather", "I don't like" and so on[/QUOTE]