Conservation Question

Has anyone had any luck with removing copper spotting from gold coins using NCS or similar services? This Albanian piece is in an MS63 holder and would likely be worth twice as much without the spots. I'm curious if anyone else has had any luck cracking out coins like this one to see if they can be cleaned-up without damaging the original look of the coin.

 

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It's my understanding that copper is mixed into the gold to give it greater strength. I could be wrong, so if anyone knows otherwise, please correct me.

With that said, I don't know how conservation could change the appearance.

Chris

 

From what I’ve read PCGS and NCS will sometimes remove copper spots depending on the coin. There is a chance they’ll come back though if successful and if they’re deep you may not like the result

 

Here's the link to the NCS...scroll down to the 'what NCS conservation can do' section and the slide the photo bar. There is a pretty heavily spotted Saint with before and after photos.

https://www.ngccoin.com/ncs-conservation/

It's a shame this coin has such prominent spots on it. It's a newer looking slab, and I wonder why they didn't try conserving first, if it was feasible. I don't think NGC is shy about telling a submitter if they think a coin will benefit from NCS.

 

Copper spots on gold isn’t a jump out issue. They may have offered and the submitter declined as most do. Some people like the spots others don’t.

 

Good point. Two times it's been offered to me I declined (IIRC correctly I might have taken them up on it another time).

 

I’ve always declined it too. I’ve always felt that if it really should be conserved I would have submitted it that way in the first place

 

That's pretty amazing what they did with that Saint! Granted, the original spots don't look like arc welding contacts like several on the Albanian piece. At this point, I'm less concerned with the spots than the grade, doesn't look like the coin rates an MS63 with all the action going on in the reverse fields. Funny thing about it, I already have the coin in PCGS AU55 that is very conservatively graded, it's one of only 2 Albanian 100 Franga coins in my collection that aren't mint state (1926-Star is an AU58) the other 7 coins are all MS62 or better.

 

If you're more concerned with the grade than the spots you can always try resubmitting them. At this point i'm not sure removing the spots on your coin would be an improvement

For the PCGS one do you agree it's an AU or was that a surprise? They are generally harder on gold overall from what I've seen

 

Coin isn't mine, at least not yet. It's in Stack's NYINC sale next week. Assuming the spots can be removed, still leaves me with the hairlines in the reverse fields to consider. Pretty much need to inspect the coin in-hand to determine how bad they really are. The PCGS AU55 already in the collection is much less proof-like than this coin, hence the wear is almost inconsequential since it doesn't affect the overall appearance of the coin that much. Coin was originally purchased raw in a Ponterio sale back in 1991, at the time it was the first Albanian 100 Franga I had ever owned.

 

The spots can be easily removed at NCS if the "right" conservator does the work. ICG also has one of the "right" people and so far, they do not charge for the service if it is not abused.

At the fun show this morning, their conservator was bitching (LOL) that some unnamed "weasel dealer" who knows better sent in 39 19th Century copper coins from the Netherlands and 32 of them were covered in dirt and crud! It took hours to fix them and he was not charged. The dealer was told that in the future, 3-5 are OK but he will get charged a few bucks extra for each coin if it is another large batch.

PS If the spots bother you, pass.

 

That actually is kind of funny when you're not the one doing the work.

 

The way I like to see with coins that's especially really hard to find is to get it at a price you like first. You can always upgrade later.

There's some coins that I have bought and have never seen again for 5+ years to a good decade. Some are excessively rare - holed, damaged etc but I don't think I regretted it (some were a bit pricey in their condition...)

 

I don't have any details graded coins in my collection, though there are a few coins out there that I would be happy to add even with problems for the right price. South Peru 8 Escudos for instance.

 

Don't remove the copper spots. Those spots are not distracting.

The orangey color shows the coin is original. Minor copper areas like that are perfectly natural on a gold coin. If you get it treated, you'll be left with "white gold" that is unattractive.

 

physics-fan3.14, posted: "Don't remove the copper spots. Those spots are not distracting. The orangey color shows the coin is original. Minor copper areas like that are perfectly natural on a gold coin. If you get it treated, you'll be left with "white gold" that is unattractive."

Jason has written a pretty decent beginners book for grading coins. I bought one and recommend it. You all have probably heard or read that grading is subjective and that eye-appeal is very important.

Therefore, if you like "heavily spotted" coins that have deteriorated since they were struck that most professionals do not like - keep the coin as is. BTW, have you ever wonder about this: Out of every 100 gold coins sent in to be conserved, what percentage do you think are simple copper spot removals?

 

Great guess! Actually, I learned that when NCS started, your 98% is within 3% give or take a %. Not so much now. Cannot say for sure but I'd guess somewhere around 40% or a little higher today. I cannot say for sure. They keep those boys in the lab away from prying eyes and ears.