Featured Chicago ANA Show Report

You could try confronting the dealer at the next show you attend. show proof that he screwed you and promise to make a big scene if he doesn't pay you your $600. if he doesn't make a scene and ruin his business.

People who con others deserve the worst that can be dealt to them.

 

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By the way Tom, I did email you about"the truth"tittle but I see you were there to see it first hand. I agree,nice write up. I was signed up to this site awhile back but am now back using it finally. I really enjoy all the information available!

 

This person who did this looked at every coin with a loupe,then tried to tell me after he got back that they were cleaned. This is also a person who claims to be the first to invent a slab. If you invented the 1st slabbing service I would think you would know how to grade. As I stated,I talked to all member's in charge of that show from the President down,gave them all the proof they need and have thus far been pretty much ignored. I even sent information to their secretary for a second time certified and the second sending,my papers came back as unknown address,at least my local post office how saw me send the 1st papers were on my side and resent the certified letter. Oh I might add that I am now afraid to take any checks,had a few sales to dealers at the Rosemont show UNTIL they pulled out their checkbook.

 

I'd bet a simple contract provision between the show organizers and the vendors (Mint, TPGs, and coin dealers) would help to clear this mess up. If a vendor wants to create a circus by releasing a product in a way that it puts a strain upon convention center security/resources then they are responsible for staffing/hiring additional security to properly control the crowds. It sounds like the mint is transferring a great deal of expense and headaches to show organizers while not covering the costs of their impacts.

 

Here's the weird part - there were at least two other "show releases" at the ANA show. Canada had a ANA Chicago privy marked Silver Maple Leaf with a matte frosted field, and Ron Landis was striking Brasher Doubloon replicas in .9999 gold at the Eureka Mint booth. None of those caused a problem.

 

Took a while to get through, but thank you all for your description of events. While it's frustrating to hear, it's good information for those of us who could not attend, but may attend future ANA shows.

 

I've seen some pictures of those doubloons they are some very nice replicas! I might pick one up down the road.

 

Thank you for providing us an "inside" look at what happens at these events and the response to them. I hope you post often. I see you just joined yesterday. Have you been following this site or are you brand new?

 

I had only run across Cointalk a few times before. Someone posted a link to this discussion on Twitter, and I found it that way. People need to be aware that the fulltime staff at ANA is minuscule, serving tens of thousands of members. They really are amazing. They number less than three dozen, and they leave some back in Colorado Springs to keep day to day operations there going on. They really run a show like the August ANA shows with about 15 folks, plus local and national volunteers. I call the dozen or so of us national volunteers "Rhonda's Minions". My full time job is with the PA House of Representatives. This was my vacation.

I'm just leaving Chicago tonight. I had Cubs tix for yesterday, and today I'm taking the Chicago Federal Reserve Bank tour.

 

Obviously it's all about the money ... the Mint's profit from 2,500 coins sold at about a 30 percent premium over melt may be calculated. If the dealers were paying $800 to people to wait in line, as I heard at the show, and people were doubling their money, well, if there's a lot of money in it for the Mint, the dealers, the grading services, and even the ANA, which must have sold a lot of day wristbands and memberships. Not criticizing the ANA, which does miracles with very little money or staff

The only problem is, it makes the hobby look ridiculous. Obviously there's a market for this stuff at such a high premium, or they would not be doing it, but I think it needs to be done differently. Say, pre-order for members as part of the pre-registration, and if too many order, do it by lottery, possibly weighted for seniority (one chance for every year you've been a member). Yes, it will cut back on dealer profits some, but right now most of them are falling to the big dealers as few can spend a night and often, part of a day, waiting. The dealers will still wind up with the bulk of them, but they will probably have to pay a bit more and won't get as many.

And I agree, it is amazing what the ANA does on a relative shoestring, god bless them.

 

While I do appreciate Mr. Bellmann's response, I do think the ANA could have done more. They could have threatened to take away the US Mint's table if they didn't fix the issue.

But, overall I agree the ANA had little to do with it. It was the mint being stupid and dealers willingly ruining the show and screwing over collectors. The mint could have stopped this by doing a better job of making everyone prove they weren't hired temp workers but collectors trying to buy for themselves. I mentioned in another thread about having people sign a sworn statement they were not hired in line, but have a better idea. Why doesn't the mint just bring their customer database with them? Make each buyer of such items prove they are on their mailing list? They would even just allow people to order it online, and pick it up in person at the show. Then, you show up, show your id and receipt, and get your coin. Hopefully something like this would prevent the massive fraud perpetrated on this hobby at one of our biggest shows, by Silvertowne and other miserable reprobates.

 

I think the most obvious answer that most are passing over is that the US Mint should never have sold these coins at the ANA Show. If you look at the US Mint product description for this coin you will note that they make a point of stating that there is a household limit for ordering to make the distribution fair. There was nothing fair at all about selling coins at the ANA Show and if the US Mint truly wanted an equitable distribution then they would have limited sales to online orders only for 30-days or so.

Simple.

 

It seems like online sales is where things are heading. I would suggest having a product launch date for in person buying, and then have internet sales start one week prior. This will take the wind out of a frenzied product launch, give the hard core mint buyers 'premier' access by purchasing online within a pre launch date time frame, and make it to where there is no real advantage over any others when new products are launched. If SilverTowne wants in on the first coins, they have to wait online like everyone else, although they could just as easily clog the system with 15 employees all trying to max out on orders within the first few minutes (extrapolate that across all the other major dealers, and you still have an initial frenzy, albeit a safer one from the comfort of your home).

 

The ANA & the mint have done this before and never had a problem.

The insanity was all due to the buyers.

 

There is absolutely no truth to this! If you were at the show and heard the pre dealers plans there was buyers in line by 7:30 AM only to watch all the bribed pawns running for the Kings.

 

Did you read my post?

What the heck did you respond to?

Some other post?

I was talking about previous ANA's, and you were talking about? Who knows what.

After 10 posts, I suggest reading carefully before saying: "There is absolutely no truth to this!" Especially when it relates to nothing that I said.

PS: I WAS there.

 

Although I collect dreck I must agree with Laura and maybe someday I'll be able to upgrade myself

 

I would totally disagree with your opening statement. The ANA is just to blame as the Mint. No more but no less either. If they knew on Monday this was imminent, and didn't take steps to avoid these problems, that's even worse. It's their show and they are responsible for what goes on within it. You just don't walk away from a problem once you collect the rent money. If they are so under resourced that they cannot properly maintain the safety and integrity of the show, they need to hire an outside agency who can run it for them. You even go on to say in another comment, they have informed the Mint there will be no further sales of this type at future events. If they have the power to enforce that now, they may have had leverage to enforce an alternative when it was "imminent". Don't they have meetings reviewing these promotions before they happen? If not, they have neglected their responsibility even further. I for one, put the blame on them as much as anyone else.

 

Who is the dealer?