Charles III Spanish Silver Real Mint Marks ?

Discussion in 'World Coins' started by serafino, Oct 1, 2019.

  1. serafino

    serafino Well-Known Member

    Does anybody know of a link to a listing of Charles III Spanish Silver Real mint marks. I look on Ebay and I have no clue what the mint marks mean. I wonder if the sellers know. I've seen the mint mark P.R. listed for different countries.
     
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  3. TheFinn

    TheFinn Well-Known Member

    A crowned R is for Madrid, S with a viaduct is Sevilla.
    For colonials, So is Santiago, Chile; Mo is Mexico City; G is Guatemala; NG is Colombia; LIMAE logo is Lima, Peru; PTS logo is Potosi, Bolivia.
    That's a start.
     
  4. serafino

    serafino Well-Known Member

    Thanks, P.R. must be one of the colonies
     
  5. lordmarcovan

    lordmarcovan Eclectic & avid numismatist Moderator

    Those LIMAE and Potosi monograms can be kind of hard to decipher the first time you see them, with the overlapping letters and all.
     
  6. Paddy54

    Paddy54 Variety Collector

    And remember the assayers mark can also be two letters. So PR maybe the coins assayer;)
     
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  7. Eduard

    Eduard Supporter**

    This link lists all of the mintmarks for most Spanish kings:

    https://www.maravedis.net/cecaslista.html

    For Carlos III the following are listed:

    Mints in Spain
    Carlos III - Cecas Peninsulares .png


    Mints in the New World and Manila.
    (Mexico is M crowned by an O)
    Carlos III C cecas americanas .png
     
  8. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    There is one more mint mark, a P with an A above it, but it's very unlikely anyone will ever have need of knowing that. Ya see, the mint of Panama is even known as the "forgotten mint". But if you should ever find such a coin, well, know that you have indeed found something worthy of special note !

    For many years it was considered by many, most even, to be a myth. But it was no myth, it existed, it's just not well known. The Panama Mint only operated for a few years, it began minting in 1580 and if memory serves after 1585 it was over and done with. But they did indeed mint coins, maravedi, and 1, 2, 3 and 4 reales.

    It was mentioned and talked about in several books on the subject, and various coins found over the years were thought to be either forgeries or fantasy coins by most because the mint's very existence had never been really proved in the eyes of most folks. But in 2005 the definitive reference on the subject was written by Jorge A. Proctor - "The Forgotten Mint of Colonial Panama". But there are few who have even heard of the book ! Partially because only 150 copies were ever printed and sold, but I happen to have one which is why I know of it. And I only know of it because of Dan Sedwick - he was Jorge's mentor.

    To my knowledge there's little online about this subject, or at least that used to be the case. It's been some years since I checked - there may be more now. Used to be you couldn't even find pictures of the coins, let alone anything else. But as knowledge is shared and grows, hopefully that will change.
     
  9. jgenn

    jgenn World Crown Collector

    Since the OP specifically mentioned Charles III silver reales, here is a link to one of my Charles III 8 reales sets that shows the mintmarks and examples from each of the mints that produced 8 reales coins. That set consists of only portrait type 8 reales which were minted from 1772-1789. The coinage of Charles III is unique among Spanish series in that it featured a major design change with the introduction of the monarch's bust as the key feature of the obverse. The principle design motif for earlier coins, including those minted under Charles III from 1760-1771 were based on the Spanish coat of arms -- and the colonial issues bore the iconic Dos Mundos/Columnario design, often referred to as the Pillar Dollar for the depiction of the Pillars of Hercules, wrapped with the national motto of Spain 'PLUS ULTRA' (further beyond), framing two globes, representing the old and new worlds. Here is a link to my Charles III 8 reales pillar dollar set with examples from most of the mints.

    Since there may be some confusion about distinguishing between mintmarks and assayer initials, I will point out that on portrait coins the mintmark always appears near the rim at 9:00 on the reverse (shield) side with assayer initials at 10:00 - 11:00. On pillar coins it always appears to the left of the date and often on the right of the date but some smaller denominations place the assayer initials to the right -- otherwise the assayers initials are in the field to the left of the crowned coat of arms of Castile and León, for colonial issues, and in the field to the left of the full coat of arms on issues from the mints in Spain.
     
  10. serafino

    serafino Well-Known Member


    Thanks for your well detailed post and your excellent collection. I was confusing the assayer's initials with the mint mark.

    BTW, are you familiar with Charles III's Silver Crown coins from when he was king of the "Kingdom of The Two Sicilies". He was a young man when he became king in 1734, he would later become king of the Spanish Empire in 1759. When Charles III was king in Southern Italy he was known as Carlo di Borbone . And all his silver coins were portrait coins minted in Naples and in Palermo.
     
  11. jgenn

    jgenn World Crown Collector

    I am aware of these issues but have not collected any. If I recall correctly, they certainly showed off his prominent beak.
     
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  12. serafino

    serafino Well-Known Member

    LOL, yes they showed off his nose in all it's glory.
     
  13. Bardolph

    Bardolph Member

    The book that you need is 'Ensayadores, las EmisionesMonetarias Hispánicas, Siglos XV-XXI' by Josep Pellicer I Bru, published in Barcelona in 2010 by the Asociación Numismatica Española.
    This is fantastic book with over 400 A4 sized pages covering every single Spanish peninsular and colonial mint, including Panama, with mint marks and the marks or initials of the essayers.
    Dr Pellicer, who died in January of this year, aged 94,was a long time president of the ANE, author of several influential studies and of course an expert on Spanish coins.
    He was of course ANE pert on
     
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  14. Bardolph

    Bardolph Member

    He was also very knowledgeable on the coinage of Spanish possessions in Europe (i.e.Spanish Netherlands, Italian possessions such as Sardinia, Milan,etc) , but these are not covered in this magnificent work
     
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  15. moneditis

    moneditis Reales de a 8

  16. serafino

    serafino Well-Known Member

    Are there any books that do cover the coins of the Spanish possessions in Europe, Italian States, Netherlands, etc.
     
  17. moneditis

    moneditis Reales de a 8

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