cent hoarding for copper/melting.

WARNING this is sort of rantish.

i didnt want to take the other persons thread way offline so ill just say what i got here. i had no idea the ban on melting was that long ago. the ban sounds bogus altogether. even if the ban isnt lifted ppl will save the coppers. i also read other newer articles about there being so many that melting them would make sense.

i almost want to delete this thread because it sounds so dumb to me. these are 28+ year old cents - not going to the amero. the ppl who run the mint really have no idea what theyre doing.

i also want to add that i really dont see myself doing it. ive gotten a couple rolls and did some searching before the copper/zinc sorting but its too much. let someone with the time and their machines sort all that junk, wrap them up and sell them to someone for the copper content. they sold at the auctions a few months ago rolls of BU 78/79 cents (14 to a box) for about 9$ after fees. i wasnt turning to my dad and saying "GEE those would be worth 20 dollars in copper!".

i forget what person in the other thread said you could probably win fighting the ban it in the courts - well someone should and get the NONSENSE over with. ive got to run but id like to hear what ppl have to say on the subject.

 

Log in or Sign up to hide this ad.

If the ban was repealed, or even if there was serious mention of repealing, the roll searcher would probably see one at about the same average as a wheat cent today. Commercial sorting machines would be used to separate the 95% copper cents from the zinc ones at the banks or the armor car companies that supply and wrap coins. Today may be the times bullion collectors of the future will remember as the "copper days", when you could find it at face.

Jim ( remembers silver at face )

 

I agree that the ban would be repealed, but that shouldn't matter. The copper is what it is, and these cents are still worth more than face. In the future, when we either elminate the cent or the pure copper ones are older, the ban will be repealed. Right now I view them like junk silver, worth more than face in bullion.

 

The ban on melting the copper cents and the five cent pieces isn't that old. Less than two years I believe.

The reason for the ban was because copper at the time was pushing towards four dollars a pound and it looked like it was probably going to go even higher. It was reaching the point where it was profitable after expenses, to melt down the copper cents. At the time the copper cents amounted to about 35% of all the cents in circulation. The concern was that if copper continued up that 35% would rapidly be pulled from circulation. The Mint would be unable to replace all those billions of coins in a timely manner and a severe coin shortage would occur. Rather than run the risk of that happening the ban was put in place. Shortly afterward the economy took a dump and the prices of the base metals went with it. Currently copper is close to the high point of two years ago and the percentage of copper cents in circulation is now down to the 20 - 25% range. I doubt if the ban will be lifted until the the percentage drops below 5%, possible below 2%. Once the percentage gets that low, if the people run out and withdrawn all the copper cents suddenly it wouldn't cause a shortage.

 

Sorry guys, but I hoarded Silver at face. I started pulling quarters in 1965 and by about 1972-3 couldn't seem to find them in change anymore. Today as a roll searcher for Cents, I pull all the copper I find. Since I look at every coin anyway, it doesn't take any more time to toss them into my sort cups rather than the dump jar. Once ina while I find a real goodie like the 1988 D RDV-006 I got this year. It makes it well worth it to me to spend my time on this facet of the hobby. It has certainly been the most profitable.

Copper coins are becoming extinct, as far as finding them in circulation and our new numismatists will collect the LMC series and Shield cents instead of the Wheats and Indian Heads simply because collecting these will be very expensive, rarer and unavailable in circulation. As fewer and fewer collect SLQ's and Flying Eagles, the hobby will evolve. I believe if I live to be about 205, I can sell my stuff for a small fortune.

gary

 

a old abc article says dec 14 2006 was when the ban started. if someone could beat them in the courts the law wouldnt mean anything.

shouldnt the copper cent be demonitized along with the nickle? they either have to mint them out of something else or get rid of the denominations. let them start making 1 and 2 dollar coins that arent ugly or massive for circulation. they got rid of the half cent over 150 years ago. what is so hard about getting rid of something now. the system is crumbling and changing the design of the cent is not going to make it any more valueble in the market place.

 

You'd be better off hoarding and refining tin cans, as tin is selling for over four times that of copper.
Guy

 

The problem with aluminum cans is that unless you wash them they attract ants. Then there is the storage problem. I can stack several hundred dollars face value of cents in the cardboard bank boxes I reuse in the bank wrappers that I also reuse in a small space.

Besides, I collect coins, not cans. I don't search cans for varieties or errors and believe doing so would be a complete waste of time. lol Just not interested in seeing if the label is rotated or over stamped. But with a coin, I am interested. Funny how that's working out. Go figure ?

I don't even think we get "Tin" cans anymore. They are coated steel, I believe. The only place I think I might find tin is in solder.

gary

 

very nicely said

 

There's more copper in a pre 1982 cent, then there is in a dime. Soon the U.S. gov. will want to melt cents to make dimes and quarters. I wonder if they are doing that already. And if they are, are they in violation of their own ban? And if they are not, how much higher does the price of copper have to go before someone says, "why are we buying expensive copper from refiners when we have all the copper we need in old cent......oh yeah, we can't melt it, silly me."

 

I'm not so sure banks and armored car companies would waste their time going through huge amounts of pennies to try to find copper cents. After all, the average person can't tell from sight what is copper and what is copper-plated zinc like people could easily distinguish silver from clad or wheats from memorials. The commercial sorting machines would have to be able to weigh each piece, and I imagine that would require serious upgrading which probably wouldn't be worth it from a bank's point of view.

 

It not that hard to create a cantilever that tips at 2.6g. But I agree, I doubt banks would do this. Now if copper got to $20/lb, I wouldn't say never.

 

Hmm an ounce for copper costs around 26c people selling 1oz libertys for $2 -.-

 

The fastest sorting machines use electrical pulses to determine the composition of any coin... takes a fraction of a second. A true, high-level industrial sorter with multiple sensors would be able to do north of 1000 cents a minute, if designed properly.

If you run the machine 24/7, you're looking at about $14,400 in cents sorted per day. At that rate, with ten machines, it would still take YEARS to sort through all the cents out there.

It could be profitable... I'm surprised that the coin counting companies don't modify their machines slightly to reject silver for selling at greater than face.

 

I am still sitting on the question if the government can legally tell you that you cannot melt your own coins. I mean, you own them and they no longer belong to the government, right ? I mean, I can light cigars with $100 bills, if I wanted and could afford to, of course. I am allowed to take my computer apart and trash it.

I mean, Native American jewelers have used the Silver in coins to make their stuff for more than a century.

Seriously, I am beginning to wonder at the legality of the melt ban on cents. Of course from a collecting point of view, melting would or should increase the value of the surviving coins, right ?

 

Wrong. The intrinsic value of a copper cent is the bullion value, and this is becomming more recognized. The comments above comparing the pulling of silver coins from circulation in the 60s to pulling copper today is entirely correct. The only drawback to copper is that it is less profitable for the effort.

 

Instead of a gold recall what about a copper recall? Copper has a higher utility value than gold. A law could be passed requiring all one and five cent pieces to be turned in except for those of "rare and numismatic value". Sound familiar?

 

There is a difference between the cash market and futures market. Even if cents were legal to melt - you'd be lucky to get 2/3's the futures price when selling to a scrap dealer.

 

I've said it before... the ban would not withstand a supreme court review, and that's how far you'd have to take it. The US Mint will protect that power at pretty much any cost.

 

I don't think there is a chance that the SC would rule to permit large-scale commercial melting of coins. It is against the common good and practicality would trump constitutional theory as it frequently has.