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<p>[QUOTE=&quot;GDJMSP, post: 2123632, member: 112&quot;]Those two comments go together quite well <img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie1" alt=":)" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" /> And they at once are also very indicative of commonly held beliefs regarding the toning of coins.</p><p><br /></p><p>The first is fairly universal, meaning the same would be said by most. But there is one thing that is generally agreed by most, that being that it can&#039;t effectively be done. Those two things are somewhat contradictory for how can one say that they know little about a given thing and yet then claim that thing can&#039;t be done ?</p><p><br /></p><p>If explored what generally comes to light is that they believe something can&#039;t be done because they have never been able to do it themselves. But just because you cannot do something yourself that most definitely does not mean that somebody else can&#039;t either. It merely means you don&#039;t know how. Thus the generally accepted idea that copper cannot be dipped effectively. However, simple observation of the evidence tells us that it can be effectively dipped, and what&#039;s more, that it is.</p><p><br /></p><p>So the first thoughts in the minds of those who do not believe is - what evidence ? It&#039;s always the same. And the answer is always the same as well - the best evidence there is, the coins themselves.</p><p><br /></p><p>I have written about this many times Winged, it&#039;s nothing new. All one has to do to know that copper can be effectively dipped is to look at the coins, and do a little thinking while doing so. Thinking about what ? Well, thinking about the nature of copper. Copper, barring the modern $1 coins, is the most reactive of our coinage metals. And like all coins copper coins begin to tone the instant after they are struck. And it tones very, very, quickly. How do I define quickly ? Copper tones in a matter of days and the only thing that is necessary for that to happen is for it to be exposed to the air. And since all coins are exposed to the air then obviously copper coins are going to be toned very soon after minting. This is a given.</p><p><br /></p><p>Now of course toning is a matter of degree, and there are many degrees. But there are 3 general classifications regarding the color of copper, Red, Red Brown, and Brown. The definitions and qualifications for such are well known and agreed upon. Red requires 95% or more of the coin to be original mint red. Red Brown 5% or more original mint red, and Red Brown less than 5% original mint red.</p><p><br /></p><p>Given that, and given what we know about the nature of copper and how quickly it tones, it then should become obvious to just about anybody that a copper coin of any age at all can rarely be Red. But yet we have tens of thousands of them slabbed as such, many of them well over a hundred years old. What&#039;s more, the TPGs know all of this to be true as well, they do not dispute it at all. This is confirmed by the fact that they will not guarantee the color designation of copper coins.</p><p><br /></p><p>So how is it it possible that we have all of these copper coins, many very old, designated as being Red ? There is only one explanation - copper can be effectively dipped. To argue otherwise ? Well, you can draw your own conclusions to that.</p><p><br /></p><p>Now as to other generally held beliefs regarding toning, much of what I said above can be applied to that as well. Progression for example, it is believed by many that it is going to be a certain way, period. Well guess what, it isn&#039;t. And the reason it isn&#039;t is that toning changes as conditions change. And with coins, conditions change all the time. So while progression will be that certain way as long as conditions remain unchanged, if conditions do change then so will the progression. In point of fact progression can stop and then start all over again every time the ownership of a given coin changes. This is also a given because toning is completely dependent upon conditions. And that toning can start in different places, and be different colors, and the previously existing colors will be changed as well to completely different colors. And all of this can lap and overlap, sometimes several times.</p><p><br /></p><p>The point I am making is that there is no set and locked in concrete way about how a coin will tone. You can have all different kinds of colors overlapping each other, and each changing the other, each with different rates of progression and even different kinds of progression. And all of this should be blatantly obvious to anybody who just stops and thinks about how toning actually works.</p><p><br /></p><p>Yes, there is a naturally occurring color spectrum that will progress in a given way, but only as long as conditions remain static - unchanging. Change the conditions and the toning changes, this is a given not a maybe.</p><p><br /></p><p>So to look at a coin and say that&#039;s AT because the progression isn&#039;t this way or that way - well guess what, your rules aren&#039;t rules after all. You only think they are. And if you do a little more thinking, you&#039;ll see that.[/QUOTE]</p><p><br /></p>

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