Bargain Over Beauty

A recent arrival has a lot of iconic history behind it, despite the fact it is rather humble looking coin.

Vespasian
Æ As, 9.19g
Lyon mint, 77-78 AD
RIC 1233 (C). BMC 845.
Obv: IMP CAES VESPASIAN AVG COS VIII P P; Head of Vespasian, laureate, r.
Rev: IVDAEA CAPTA; S C in exergue; Palm tree; to r., Judaea std. r.; to l. of tree, arms
Acquired from Zuzim, October 2018.

The amount of propaganda the Flavian regime was able to squeeze out of the Jewish War is astounding. Here we have an As struck seven or eight years after the fall of Jerusalem still touting the Jewish defeat. It was the singular event that more than anything else gave the dynasty its prestige. It would have been unseemly to celebrate the defeat of fellow Romans after the end of the Civil War, but quite appropriate to do so over an eastern people, despite the fact they were within the boundaries of the Roman empire. This As was struck in a fairly large issue from the Lyon mint, presumably to address a shortage of bronze coinage in the western provinces late in Vespasian's reign.

Judaea Capta coins command premium prices, despite their overall commonness. I got this one for a little over $200, which I felt was a bargain. I have most of the types in silver, this is the first bronze of the series I've added. Both the price and the fact it reads IVDEAE CAPTA on the reverse were the deciding factors the impelled me to hit the purchase button. At least it isn't tooled or smoothed as many of these types are.

Post your bargains!

 

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Congrats on the addition.

 

Great coin David. with nice toning and historical background. At first glance it looked like Vespasian is wearing specs.

 

The coin is actually a modern Harry S Truman coin imitating the Judea Capta series.

Just kidding. Nice coin.

 

Awesome coin, David, and truly beautiful to those who are fascinated with ancient Judaean history!

Thank you for creating this thread. I was getting ready to post my latest purchase in a new thread but when I saw yours, I decided that it belongs here. I already have a Vespasian Judaea Capta denarius but not of this quality with the complete "IVDAEA" on the reverse. I consider this coin a bargain and I acquired it from the same excellent dealer from whom you acquired your superb coin (ZUZIM)

 

Congratulations! I love it when the right coin finds the right home where it would be appreciated. I am not a super-fan of Judaea Capta coins so I would not have bought the coin but I really doubt that you would have bought several of my 'treasures' so all is well. How much we pay for coins that have problems of one sort or another is a difficult matter. Unfortunately, many prices are set by demand for the coin by people who do not otherwise collect coins so we have to pay more or accept less than might seem reasonable. Judaea Capta is certainly one of these.

My less than perfect coin I always wanted is an as of Antoninus Pius with the reverse showing Mars approaching Rhea Silvia, mother of Romulus and Remus. It appeals to people who are into Roman history/mythology. The local art museum has one a bit nicer on display as one of a total of about 20 ancient coins. This one was $175 which is about three times what would be expected for an as of Antoninus Pius with Mars by himself. The coin does have some smoothing (bad!) but it is the only one I have seen recently at anything approaching my price. Bargain? Foolish rip-off? It all depends on whose definitions we are using.

 

Those are great Judaea Capta coins, David and Deacon Ray.

I will, in the new year, hopefully be looking at getting one for a bargain myself.

I think you did good, Doug. Too bad about the smoothing, though.

Erin

 

Yeah, Isadore is the guy to go to for Judaea Capta coins. You got a nice one there.

 

Nice bargains, David and Deacon Ray & Doug. I really enjoy threads like this since my whole collection is pretty much nothing but "bargains." No Judea Captas, but a recent Flavian and an Antoninus Pius sestertius came my way in October:

Here's Vespasian with 2 oxen. I actually had one of these, but this is, believe it or not, an upgrade. It is not fourree - the green crud is on the surface - this was buried with some bronze, I'm guessing. It was $10. Seller's photos:



Vespasian Denarius
(77-78 A.D.)
Rome Mint
IMP CAESAR VESPASIANVS AVG, laureate head left / Yoke of two oxen left; COS VIII in exergue.
RIC 944; RSC 134a.
(3.07 grams / 17 mm)

As for Antoninus Pius, I was not aware of the Rhea Silvia type - wow! Now I want one. But here is an Antoninus Pius I've long wanted, a posthumous one with some architecture. At $39.95 it was more than I usually spend, but my "eBay Bucks" reward came in which put it under $30, so I pulled the trigger. Given the condition, it might not be much of a "bargain," but I'm happy with it:



Antoninus Pius Æ Sestertius
Posthumous Issue
(died 161 A.D.)
Rome Mint
DIVVS ANTO[NINVS], bare head right / [DIVO PIO], Column of Antoninus, -C.
RIC 1269 (Marcus Aurelius); BMCRE 880 (Marcus Aurelius); Cohen 354.
(20.83 grams / 30 mm)

 

Nice one, David. Those Judaea Capta bronzes seem to get really pricey really quick, even with just small increments in condition.

At about $170, I thought this Sextus Pompey denarius with the Catanaean Brothers reverse was a nice enough bargain that I would have played it as my next coin in the recent Imperator challenge, had I made it past my last round. Its condition is the very definition of modest, but the design on the reverse is much more complete than many examples out there that would have cost more and yet be worth less to me.



On the other hand, here's my example of the A-Pi Mars & Rhea Silvia bronze that Doug showed. Like him, I really wanted one of them, and I paid for my example a bit more than four times what he paid for his. Perhaps more to the point, I paid about twice more than the previous owner did a few years earlier. So, no, I don't think I scored a bargain. Maybe I'll change my mind if it next sells for twice what I paid? Fat chance, but it's a moot point since I'm never selling it and will never find out.

 

I've shown this coin before, but this is appropriate topic, so I'll show it again. This coin was in a lot of 13 silver coins that I bought in an auction for $425, or about the price of the Pupienus alone. By selling the 12 other coins on eBay, I ended up getting it for less than $100:

Silver Double Denarius
Rome mint, A.D. 238
Obv: IMP C M CLOD PVPIENVS AVG
Rev: P M TR P COS II P P -Emperor, togate, standing, facing left, holding caduceus and scepter.
RIC 5
19mm, 3.3g.

 

I certainly agree that what you have there is a historically significant coin and at bargain price, I just may not agree that it is rather humble - actually, I think it is quite nice.

I have the same one - paid about the same that you, did if I recall.

 

I picked this one up from Frank Robinson - went for less than $50 as I recall which is pretty cheap for an AE1 of Arcadius. Most of his coins are tiny securitas republicae types...also my avatar presently. It weighs in at almost 6 grams.

 

Bargains are the reason my collection is so gosh darned big!

Pontius Pilate AE prutah from a lot of small bronze coins, 10 for $6 shipped. Sold the other 9 coins for $4


Spotted this Procopius in an unidentified lot, average $1 per coin, think I paid $13 shipped for all of them?


Another lot find, got this with two really nice Constantine posthumous coins, a good Theo. II cross, and a couple other decent LRB's in a lot, all for $25


Divo Claudio muled with a Quintillus Pax reverse, $2/coin lot find


An unpublished Constantine I mule from Arles, PROVIDENTIAE CAESS / T*AR reverse, got a lot of about 25 coins for $35 shipped, all of them much better than average grade, many of them rare

 

Some great finds @Finn235 ! The one with the monogram is very good for its type!

 

I agree. Most of Finn's coins are really quite special for a reason I doubt everyone would appreciate but that is what makes it extra special that Finn does appreciate them. Of those shown, I would rate the Pilate as the worst deal but we all overpay now and then either in our own eyes or the eyes of the world. It might be interesting how many lots of coins Finn examined and rejected on the way to finding these winners. Were these online or in-person finds? Twice in my collecting life, I have bought lots of over 30 coins because there was one coin in the group that I really wanted. I did retain some others from both of those lots but would not have bought either had the one coin not been there. In each case, some of the people I showed the coins believed the best coins in the lot did not include the one that made me buy the lot. I don't know where Finn lives but I am glad he and the coins could find each other.

 

My third or fourth coin purchase at all was a small lot of cleaned but unattributed bronze coins, mostly late Romans in bad condition. Judging from what the dealer had on offer, he was selling off an old collection and this was what he considered scrapes from the bottom of the barrel. I paid $15 for the lot, and among all the slugs, I found this:


Baldwin of Bourcq, County of Edessa, AE Follis, 1110–1118 AD. Obv: Baldwin in conical helmet and chain-armor, standing l., sheathed sword at hip, holding globus cruciger, BA[Λ] - ΔOI[N] around. Rev: Floriate cross in Byzantine style. 20mm, 4.01g. Ref: Schlumberger I,9; Metcalf 109–112; CCS 10.

It is not a beauty, but in fairly good shape for the type – actually, I'd confidently challenge you to show me a better specimen. Coins minted for the main protagonists of the First Crusade are often both rare and sought after, and this particularly applies to coins by Baldwin, who in 1118 AD became the second Christian king of Jerusalem (not counting Godfrey, who was never crowned). I don't think this type has been shown on Cointalk before, and when examples are offered on the market, they usually fetch prices far above what I am normally willing to pay for a coin.

In light of all this, I consider this the best bargain I ever made on a coin. Though, thinking about it, it probably also got me hooked and fully lost to this expensive hobby...

 

Nice one David. I had one of these as my first Judea Capta types but have since sold it, thought it would be easy to upgrade...


Vespasian Judea Capta Ae As

IMP CAES VESPASIAN AVG COS III
Laureate head of Vespasian right

IVDAEA CAPTA SC
Judea as mourning captive seated right amidst arms at foot of palm-tree

Rome 71 AD

10.54g

Sear 2357
RIC 303 (R)

Ex-Incitatus

SOLD!

Celebrates the success of Vespasian and Titus in quelling the First Jewish Revolt and the destruction of the Temple in Jerusalem

From Curtis Clay:
The same type is more common with IVDEA (one A omitted): RIC 305 (C). However. IVDAEA CAPTA asses as a group are rarer than the corresponding sestertii, which add a standing Jew or the standing emperor to the type of Judaea mourning below a palm tree.

 

As Doug Smith pointed out to me in a PM, the Pupienus that I posted above is a denarius, not a double denarius or antoninianus. Drinking and numismatics don't mix . . . well, okay, they do mix pretty good actually, but you make a lot more mistakes.

 

Thanks, @ancient coin hunter and @dougsmit ! I have a few search queries that I use on the regular, takes a lot of time, but sometimes it really pays off.

Some fun individual buys, mostly from ebay.

Maximus Caesar AE Sestertius, $35

Seller stopped listing coins after that. Oops.

Nero AR Denarius, talked the seller from $200 down to $150 shipped. Didn't make an offer until I did enough poking around to confirm it as an obverse die match to known certified examples.


Valentinian III AV Tremissis from a couple Leu auctions ago. Think it worked out to be $280 after fees etc? Didn't realize until later that this is a very rare reverse type (not many Eastern emperors minted for the West), just a handful of examples on acsearch.info


From the same auction, Didia Clara, about $250? Not a looker, but she is tough to snag for under $1,000.


If you are comfortable sorting out the fakes, ebay is a great source for snagging non-classical coins.

Gupta empire, Kumaragupta AR drachm, $15


Satavahana kingdom, Yajna Satakarni AR Drachm, $65?

Seller tried to minimize his losses by bidding on his own coin, and won it for over $120. Gave me a second chance offer, which I declined. Won it the next time around for about half the original amount. Sorry, not sorry.

Kidarites, Durla Deva base gold stater, $60? Don't know the purity, but there is a good chance that in an 8g coin, I paid significantly less than melt.


Kunindas, Amoghabhuti AR drachm, $40