bad coin grading services

I don't agree with this top 4......

ICG is I think what is mean't here........

I will agree with checking their stuff out, but one must really know thier series and how to grade in order to find those that may cross......

I see a big gap between then and PCGs and NGC....

With that said I have found some wonderful GEMs here.....
But on average, you better know what your looking for...

 

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We all know this. The point was that the top four need to be used if buying slabs.

 

Jeff,

I understand your logic. The people in this industry that grew up with coins are held in high esteem because of their knowledge. A perfect example is Q. David Bowers. This gentleman has spent 50 years in the hobby, wrote many books, and owned a few of the biggest firms the hobby has ever known. While not a grader, I would buy from Mr. Bowers sight unseen any day.
He is one of a very select few that have had a major impact on the hobby.
Graders are doing a job. The researchers are the ones that give the graders the knowledge of what to look for in grading. They are the backbone of grading. Research is what numismatics is all about. That is why most are held in such regard. Understanding the facets of coinage is a bit tougher than grading in general.
I hope that makes sense.

 

Just based on the current market regardless of grading company favorites, I would buy certain NGC graded coins and cross them over to PCGS and sell them. The PCGS coins often sell for multiple times the price. For example, look at going prices for Proof Silver American Eagles.

 

I typed out a long response and thought better of it in this day and age of lawsuits.....


New collectors, stick with PCGs and NGC, and ANACs if the price is right.

As you develope your grading eye, then look for bargains in some of the other companys slabs....

 

queenkoin,

I did not intend to offend you, I am truly sorry if I did.

As I am sure you are aware of, most people, especially new collectors often get ripped off by bad grading services. While I would love to teach grading skills here on this forum, it just isn't possible. So therefor, my next best option is providing them with the best grading services available. Most of us have rehashed which is best, and which is worst. We have also rated them according to our own impressions. But so far, we all have in common that the top four are the same. I certainly do not wish to get involved any more than I already am with other services. I will only recommend these four.
I hope that clears it up. Again I am sorry if I offended.

 

In my post I mentioned 3 companys......

I'll say again, PCGs, NGC, and ANACs......

develope your grading eye new collectors, PCGs does have a book out that can be helpful. Go to coin stores, go to shows, join a coin club. Study as many graded coins as you possibly can in the series that you choose to collect. And at that I would recommend beggining with PCGs and NGC...... Learn what these two, THE TOP TWO, look for in each grade, cause I'll tell you, when you advance in grading skills each service has a 'certian look' that they look for in a coin before they holder it with a Ultra Gem status.....

When you advance in skill and build confidence in the series that you choose, then consider finding 'gems' in some of the other companys holders, they are out there, but you must sharpen that grading eye.

It is very diffulcult if not impossible to grade from a scan/image, however, I still encourage you to look at images because they can give you a general feel for a coin. Larry Whitlows website usually has some very accurate and blown up images of their inventory which can be very very useful.

When buying a coin on ebay, donot shy away from asking the seller questions about its strike, bagmarks, or for more images... If a seller doesn't share any info it could be, could be a major red flag and a bad sign.


As you develope that grading eye and understand what your grading company of choice likes to see in its holders, you can then find many raw GEMs at great prices and have the graded if you desire....

I have both raw and certified, I had assembled one of the top Franklin Half sets in the country, I went thru several bumps and bruises along the way, I now enjoy bringing many freshly graded ultra Gems to the market and supplying some of the top PCGs Regsitry sets with Franklins, Washingtons, Roosevelts and coming soon Winged Libertys.. I've got some stunners, and at a recent coin show in Vegas, the HepKitty was able to find many knockout Ultra Gems raw.....

My definition of a Ultra Gem is:
Franklins ms66fbl and above...
Washingtons ms67
Roosies ms67fb
Winged Libertys ms67fb

Let me tell you newbies, it is a killer feeling when you found a raw GEM, submit it for grading and make the big score! I love it!

Here is a coin that I got kind of cheap, I had it going PR67Cam.....
PCGs agreed with me: (lint is on the holder)



This is a great score and a Coin that if it had a hair more mirror depth would have been a Major score, a 53 Frankie in a pr67 Cameo is very tough. These coins are usually hairlined and milkspotted to death....

Proof coins are a whole different ball game and can be tough to grade.
NGC focuses on Frost for their lofty Ultra Cam status while PCGs focuses more on mirror depth for their Deep Cameos.... Now I don't know that either of these companys would admit to that, but this is what one learns when they study their holders and discover what exactly it is that each company is looking for in a given grade. NGC is more forgiving with hairline (tiny fine scratches) whith PCGs they can be grade killers...

Sharpen that eye, Gainn knowledge, and enjoy the hobby...

The biggest hobby killer is buying overgrading coins and losing your shirt if you have to sell and/or finding nobody wants your coins....

Collecting is all about collecting, and not neccesarly making money or a profit, but with that said, you can enjoy the hobby and put yourself in a good position should the time come to sell, and that day is probably coming, as we are temporary stewards of the coins we posses, preserving them for future generations...

Happy Collecting,
Lucille

 

What does gray-sheets offer?

I found this site...pretty interesting as I could figure out who is doing well and who is not doing so well. Does anybody put stock in these rankings?

http://www.greysheet.com/cdn/cdnccmi.asp

 

Hey, QUEENKOIN, nice post. Your are an inspiration to us all. By the way, did you get your 43 Walker back from PCGS yet?

Also, I like that you use the term "winged liberty" dime instead of "mercury". Our nation never intended to put a Roman god on our coinage, so I will always call them "winged liberty" dimes from now on.

 

I have been collecting coins for 40 yrs now and was browsing on e-bay when I found coins graded by SGS. I had never heard of this grading company so I asked around. I asked other collectors and dealers in my part of the world (Dallas, TX). No one could give me any information on them, so I bid on some MS70 dimes a group from 1950-1959. I won the bid at at very low price and was thrilled I was going to get these High Grade coins at this price..........WRONG........VERY WRONG. They might grade MS62-MS64 four of them anyway. I left a netural comment as feedback, and was black listed, blocked, and other e-bay sellers were told to stay away from me. I questioned the feedback and received a rather harsh e-mail from the CEO of abon.com. As I expected he is also the CEO of SGS.....Star Grading Service...
My advice is to stay away from SGS and stick to the better known grading services PCGS, NGC are my personal picks.

By the way the CEO is Larry L. Bence

 

it never ends...

our old friends at SGS are grading currency now...
http://cgi.ebay.com/1929-10-00-T2-N...QitemZ8362409345QQcategoryZ3421QQcmdZViewItem

 

at what point will SGS be shut down? this is insane!

My local coin dealer got in a whole pile of SGS graded coins, they did not purchase them at MS-70 prices though

it was so funny looking at these things, most of the MS70 and PRF70 coins where nicked, scratched, etc.

it sucks what he did to you bigdave, sounds like ebay doesn;t care about its users ( except the ones they get huge commisions off of )

 

I really don't think there is a way to shut down a business....this is a free country....I think the best thing to do is try to tell people the truth as much as we can....I know what happened to people that did that to ACG but it worked.

Speedy

 

Also who is the service on Home Shopping Network, ICG? or something? The host is a real shister and he makes it sound like he is only one you can get coins from, and from the US Mint. And his hokey gold plated quarters, what's with that? The other day he was selling $5 gold coins for $199.00 each.

 

Watched a guy last night take a pair of scissors and cut open a '63 proof set on HSN. He pulls out the Franklin bare handed and molested it for about 5 minutes.

 

Must be the same guy, I can't stand that guy, I watch him only because he's so obnoxious.

 

I always thought ICG was fairly reputable... certainly not in the same category as SGS.

 

LOL!!! Thats hilarious. If its the guy I'm thinking of, he is definately the dumbest of the TV coin show hosts.

 

Ok lets try this one more time

A little info on Aboncom the scammer selling the SGS crap on Ebay

The following information was obtained by a whois domain lookup.
The below information is 100% public information.

"Aponcom" is the ebay user id of the guy selling SGS Graded Coins.
SGS coins mainly originate from the above person.

The names Erick Sparks is on abon.com and David Sparks is on stargrading.org. Maybe Brothers? who knows could be sisters

At best this is a major conflict of interests. Selling coins you grade yourself or having your brother do it for you. SHAME on you two!

One thing is for sure, not either one of you guys are not little angles!



Abon.com Whois PUBLIC information

Registrant:
Abon Limited
115 Park Ave. West
Mansfield, OH 44902
US
419-522-5346x123
Fax:419-522-6379


Domain Name: ABON.COM

Administrative Contact:
Sparks, Eric eric@abon.com
115 Park Ave. West
Mansfield, OH 44902
US
419-522-5346x123
Fax:419-522-6379


Technical Contact:
Sparks, Eric eric@abon.com
115 Park Ave West
Mansfield, OH 44902
US
419-522-5346x123
Fax:419-522-6379


Record last updated 02-20-2006 10:04:20 AM
Record expires on 11-18-2007
Record created on 11-19-1997

Domain servers in listed order:
NS1.HOSTICA.COM 216.116.124.201
NS2.HOSTICA.COM 208.179.102.202
NS3.HOSTICA.COM 208.179.130.13
-----------------------------------------------------------------

Domain ID93334068-LROR
Domain Name:STARGRADING.ORG
Created On:21-Dec-2002 14:19:57 UTC
Last Updated On:10-Oct-2006 13:28:46 UTC
Expiration Date:21-Dec-2008 14:19:57 UTC
Sponsoring Registrar:Tucows Inc. (R11-LROR)
Status:OK
Registrant ID:tuaautIu7Rql4RbR
Registrant Nameavid Sparks
Registrant Organization:Star Grading Service
Registrant Street1:38 Church Street
Registrant Street2:
Registrant Street3:
Registrant City:Bellville
Registrant State/Province:OH
Registrant Postal Code:44813
Registrant Country:US
Registrant Phone:+1.4809936484
Registrant Phone Ext.:
Registrant FAX:
Registrant FAX Ext.:
Registrant Email:stargrading@gmail.com
Admin ID:tutOJw0HzuyoF1VJ
Admin Nameavid Sparks
Admin Organization:Star Grading Service
Admin Street1:38 Church Street
Admin Street2:
Admin Street3:
Admin City:Bellville
Admin State/Province:OH
Admin Postal Code:44813
Admin Country:US
Admin Phone:+1.4809936484
Admin Phone Ext.:
Admin FAX:
Admin FAX Ext.:
Admin Email:stargrading@gmail.com
Tech ID:tuOaSt7rnDP83jKo
Tech Nameavid Sparks
Tech Organization:Star Grading Service
Tech Street1:38 Church Street
Tech Street2:
Tech Street3:
Tech City:Bellville
Tech State/Province:OH
Tech Postal Code:44813
Tech Country:US
Tech Phone:+1.4809936484
Tech Phone Ext.:
Tech FAX:
Tech FAX Ext.:
Tech Email:stargrading@gmail.com
Name Server:NS1.PLAINHOST.COM
Name Server:NS2.PLAINHOST.COM
Name Server:NS3.PLAINHOST.COM

Ok Mr David Or Eric Sparks, Please feel free and explain this one, if you can???

This isn't ebay and this message isn't going away anytime soon. After all it is public information that you yourselves put on record.. Thanks guys for the info it was a big help.

-------------------------------------

More Public information found with a google Search using their names and state.

David A Sparks (419) 886-3488 38 Church St, Bellville, OH 44813
Star Grading 480-993-6484 38 Church Street Bellville, OH 44813

Eric Sparks (419) 522-0651 508 Harter Ave, Mansfield, OH 44907
Abon Limited 419-522-5346x123 115 Park Ave. West Mansfield, OH 44902

Just under 10 miles apart..

http://coinscams.entryhost.com/images/sgs.gif
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Any Questions????