Authentic VS. Counterfeit 1914 D Lincoln

In this thread I will try my best to point out a few differences between a counterfeit, and an authentic Lincoln 1914 D.
(authentic pictures courtesy of Heritage)

The 09 S VDB and the 1914 D are coins that someone would usually give a full examination. Whereas the 31 S, I feel is a coin that is so readily available in high MS grades, that someone might overlook this coin and not inspect it as closely as they should. (In another upcoming thread)
The 1909 S VDB can be read about here. There are several obvious tells that this coin is a counterfeit, feel free to chime in with comments and questions.

The 1914 D on the other hand I feel could pass as authentic alot easier then the S VDB.
Here is a large photo of the Obverse of a 1914 D counterfeit. When I first pulled it out of the package I felt it was fairly well done, and the improperly mixed planchet makes it look like a woody, and easily hides the grainy cast look.
The genuine example should weigh in at 3.11 grams, whereas this counterfeit example weighs in at 3.09 grams.
Very close!



Upon closer inspection of the lettering and date on the coin you can easily see the "grainy" look you find on cast coins. If you're not quite sure what you're looking for, look all along the rim on both pictures. Just above the words, and just below the rims. You can see how it looks grainy and uneven. That is the "cast" look. The letters and numbers aren't clear and crisp like you would expect on an authentic coin.

COUNTERFEIT





AUTHENTIC 1914 D MS 66RD NGC
Hammer price:
25,875.00



Although the amount of "wear" on the Obverse, compared to the "wear" on the Reverse is not uniform. It isn't really something that would worry someone that is hunting for this key date. Although the Reverse Dies are generally used longer then the Obverse Dies, the 1914 D Obverse is always lacking more detail then the reverse.
The picture with black is a counterfeit example, and the white background is the MS 66 example.







The last thing is the mintmark. The genuine mintmark will sit in a little bit of a depression from the displacement of metal when teh mintmark was struck. The counterfeit examples won't. Here is a close up of the Counterfeit, then the genuine date and mintmark.

 

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Nice post Sean. I really hope it helps some people out prior to overpaying for a fake. My only question, would it be possible for the amount of wear to affect the weight of a coin enough to take off .02 grams therefore not a "marker" to distinguish? Only a question. But then I guess it would also depend on grade.

 

The mint tolerance is +- 5%. That means 2.96 to 3.26 grams is "normal". Therefore, 3.09 is meaningless.

 

The first thing I noticed was how intact the rims were and how unworn the lettering was compared to the bust portrait, which seemed a full 3-4 grades bellow the rest of the obverse detail.
Guy~

 

Sean
Nice post.


I tried to nominate you, but I have been prohibited.

Doug?

I got this message:
Treashunt, you do not have permission to access this page. This could be due to one of several reasons:

Your user account may not have sufficient privileges to access this page. Are you trying to edit someone else's post, access administrative features or some other privileged system?
If you are trying to post, the administrator may have disabled your account, or it may be awaiting activation.

 

Thank you for the informative thread, snaz. I think someone needs to keep us informed as counterfeits keep getting better.

 

Don't feel alone. I get the same message.

 

It still will not work.

hmmm.........

hey, Doug:
Are you mad at me?

 

I noticed this way back when I was a kid. So far all the scales I've ever used showed such differences in weight on all coins due to wear mostly. Also, I suspect that the Mint can not and does not weigh every coin so such differences can and should be normal.
Regardless such post as this are educational but very limited to being viewed. Within a few weeks or even less it will be lost as it fades to page 2, 3, etc and is lost except for those that search for past items. There have been many posts about forgeries, counterfeits, fakes and copies and they just slowly fade away unfortunately.

 

yeah, I pretty much made these so they will show up in google search and bring curious collectors in. I made sure to use the "tag" feature so it is more likely to show up in search results.
Just wait 'til you guys see the 3 legger, or the 2.5$ gold eagle!

 

To me, position of the mintmark on the 14-D Lincoln cent is often a major tell. The mm has a distinct, S/SW bias that's noticeable when you compare the authentic with the counterfeit in the pictures above.

My question is: Is mintmark placement pretty consistent among obverse dies for this date/mm? I've never seen a legitimate 14-D with a mintmark in the position shown in the counterfeit example, but I certainly have not seen every 14-D cent ever made.

 

Post of the day!

 

I do not have a list of the positions of the mm for the 14-D, but I did look at ~25 from Heritage. I found none with the "D" like the counterfeit. That is not to say that the mm is consistently placed. For most coins, there are enough mm's that they cannot be used to determine authenticity. However, the mintage is low enough here that it may be possible. There are 4 positions for the S VDB. Just guessing, there might be 6 - 10 positions for the 14-D.

 

Please note that my original post had an error in it, since corrected. The bias is S/SW.

 

Nice write up. I doubt many if anyone would have caught it as a fake if you didn't mention it was. It's almost like once everybody realizes a coin is fake by the title of a thread, then it will be closely scrutinized by everybody and people will describe what they see wrong with it.

I don't know that pictures posted in normal posts here receive the same amount of scrutiny and attention. This was good enough to where it isn't painfully obvious it was a fake. Maybe someone would have spoken up. Maybe not. Anybody here interested in helping people identify fakes on this forum needs to be aware of what they're seeing here!!

Since you mentioned it, I see exactly the graininess you mention and have seen the same in person. You can also notice the letters are just 'slightly' blockier and softer than a real one. Very subtle. Again, nobody would notice if not paying attention. I probably wouldn't have noticed.

The mintmark is obviously not right as someone mentioned. Another clue to look for.
Yet another good education of what's out there and what could be posted here as a real one. Goes to show how critical, good, large sized pics are to verifying anything that's loose. Anything less is completely inadequate.

 

I can't recall ever seeing a mintmark in that location either.

Thankyou!

Yeah, I agree some wouldn't have caught it. Although I am going to try and refrain from trying to sneak one past people in a thread. I spent money on these suckers, they are going to be posted as counterfeits, and hopefully saves someone BIG money in the future.
Some of these are extremely good. The 16 D Merc is impressive.
These guys will never leave my collection, unless someone I know and trust, asks to borrow one to study. Then I'm sure we could make an exception.

 

Great thread, I tried to nominate it but was unable to do so. Looks like a system glitch of some sort.

 

Yeh, kinda bummed about that. Would be my first TOTW nomination, oh well. It's still searchable!

 

Note the line between the P and L of PLURIBUS.

I have recently found two more examples of this fake being sold or already sold on eBay.

 

FWIW, your coin on the left (ct360) is not the same coin as either you other coin nor the op's coin.