Attribute This

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by Marshall, Jan 5, 2017.

  1. TypeCoin971793

    TypeCoin971793 Just a random guy on the internet

    Jack D. Young likes this.
  2. Avatar

    Guest User Guest



    to hide this ad.
  3. Marshall

    Marshall Junior Member

    I really don't think this is Reverse P, even if it is the best match. Look at the berry stems where they connect with the wreath stem At (N)T.

    S-204 Berri stems-horz.jpg
    They just look different to me. Particularly the inner berry stem.
     
  4. Marshall

    Marshall Junior Member

    I just purchased another coin with similar characteristics.

    S-204 O.jpg S-204 R.jpg

    It has some characteristics of the Subject (long stem on the lower left inner berry and a stem on inner berry left of C(E)) and some of the comp for Reverse P almost vertical stem on inner berry at (N)T. It also has one new feature, a falling berry left of O. Both the subject and the comp are horizontal or just above horizontal.

    It requires some thought to determine what are photo differences, die differences, strike differences and/or die state/stage differences even before PMD. At the moment, I'm having difficulty identifying the obverse though I suspect 11 or 12.

    Looking at a late State S-204. the obverse "ding" may be a CUD which forms in the late Die States of 11.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2018
    TypeCoin971793 likes this.
  5. Marshall

    Marshall Junior Member

    This is a comp for Obverse 11 (Noyes Die State F) Breen Variety S S-204 R(F) (VIII).jpg tate VIII. I think it's the same.
     
    Jack D. Young likes this.
  6. Marshall

    Marshall Junior Member

    Here is the subject and a Comp showing the Die Crack of 1800 Reverse P State B. The Comp shows a later die State when that crack is easier to see. 1852114848402-vert.jpg
     
    TypeCoin971793 and Omegaraptor like this.
  7. Marshall

    Marshall Junior Member

    It arrived today and the obverse Ding is really that. The edge has a double ding at that location making the obverse CUD possibility much lower. It is in need of more verifying data now. While it is still possible that it is both, it's not likely.
     
  8. Marshall

    Marshall Junior Member

    This is one I just acquired, it is the same one I thought I should have had after the shill messed up the last auction. I got it for $100 less without a shill.

    Anyway, attribute this to see why I didn't walk away.

    Obv.jpg Rev.jpg
    While your at it, suggest a grade. Note, This variety was struck with axially misaligned dies causing weakness at the southwest obverse and northwest reverse.
     
    Jack D. Young likes this.
  9. Jack D. Young

    Jack D. Young Well-Known Member

     
    Marshall likes this.
  10. Marshall

    Marshall Junior Member

    I'm not sure this is better, but here is my shot and an inverted reverse which should match up with any clashes. There does not appear to be any rotation of the reverse.
    18531142748721.jpg Rev Clash.jpg
     
  11. C-B-D

    C-B-D Well-Known Member

    The fraction is covered up with verdigris. Can anyone attribute this 1801?
    DSCN5758-horz.jpg
     
  12. Marshall

    Marshall Junior Member

    S-224

    The leaf under the upper upright of M limits it to the S-223 or S-224. The lack of a scratch from the left wreath stem towards the U is the most obvious tell that it is the latter.

    Position of the highest leaf is another.
     
    C-B-D likes this.
  13. C-B-D

    C-B-D Well-Known Member

    Thanks!
     
  14. Marshall

    Marshall Junior Member

    No Problem.
     
  15. Jack D. Young

    Jack D. Young Well-Known Member

    Received my PCGS images of this one; coin looks pretty good "in-hand".

    S-66-pcgs.png
     
    Eduard and Moekeever like this.
  16. Marshall

    Marshall Junior Member

    I have to hand it to the photographer. He lit up the diagnostic crack from the dentil along side the pole to the neck well. I love it.
     
    Jack D. Young likes this.
  17. Jack D. Young

    Jack D. Young Well-Known Member

    I thought that was cool as well Marshall- thanks for the note!
     
  18. Marshall

    Marshall Junior Member

    I almost missed this one. It's not exactly pretty nor rare, but it is numismaticaly interesting as the transition from Reverse State G before becoming State H.

    S-207 Obv.jpg S-207 Reverse.jpg
     
    NSP likes this.
  19. Eduard

    Eduard Supporter**

    The new picture really highlights the details well, Jack.
    A great find that was!
     
    Jack D. Young likes this.
  20. Marshall

    Marshall Junior Member

    I see this S-97 on eBay, but unfortunately out of my price range. But it may be a unique die state. Note the crack along the top of TY to the rim right of Y. Noyes Die State C makes no mention of this crack focusing in on a crack at the dentils from K2-K4 and his State D already has a developed CUD at this location. A brief search through Heritage Auctions shows no similar crack.

    s-l1600.jpg
     
    Moekeever and C-B-D like this.
  21. Marshall

    Marshall Junior Member

    After looking at Breen, this appears to be a case where Breen's focus on this particular crack is different from Noyes focus on the higher crack through the dentils. His Die State V illustration shows this crack well, though it is first mentioned in State III.

    It is interesting that the Heritage examples all appear to be prior to III or after V which might indicate that States III, IV and V are at least scarce though Breen gives no indication of this.
     
    Moekeever and C-B-D like this.
Draft saved Draft deleted

Share This Page