Are CAC stickers useless on MS?

I have a hard time believing they would be seeing 10 Mercs for every barber to make up for that discrepancy given that most Mercs wouldn't fall into the price range where submission makes sense unless trying to get a gold

 

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@baseball21, please show us how you get the CAC population report page to show you the "rate" of pass and fail coins, like the classic commemoratives you gave as an example? The page only shows me how many commems are stickered and in what grade. It doesn't show me anything like what you're claiming.

 

So what you're saying is that you have no evidence? So it is your opinion, right? And are you comparing to Barber dimes, quarters, halves? Please be more specific.

 

The data is there. You're capable of comparing sticker numbers to populations. If you couldn't figure out that was a dime to dime comparison well.....

 

Where's the data? Where is the number of failed coins? Or are these alternative facts? Lol. YOU DON'T KNOW THE RATIO OF FAILED CAC TO PASSED CAC, right? And, you don't know the comparison numbers of CAC submissions between barber and merc dimes, either, right?

 

Funny how my observation was dismissed by @baseball21 as invalid, but mere speculation is totally acceptable to warrant his observation as fact.

I wasn't basing my observation that the ratio of CAC coins to non-CAC coins appears to be increasing on only one Instagram post. The post was provided to further illustrate my comment. I also didnt try to pass my observation off as fact. I prefaced my comment with "I could be wrong". My observation is simply based on what I am seeing and noticing across several places.

For example, I have seen a steady increase in CAC coins on eBay. You can filter search on ebay to show you PCGS & CAC or NGC & CAC. It also tells you how many are listed. This number has not only gone up every month for the last 2 years, it has also increased when compared to PCGS & NGC coins that do not have CAC.

 

. . .

You mean sight-unseen PCGS and NGC plastic to trade. The rest don't matter. Now I wonder why that is.

 

Perhaps arrogance, perhaps the others weren't viewed as consistent enough to begin with, perhaps because their customers don't buy anyone else's slabs. Don't forget, this is not just "the guy who helped found both PCGS and NGC." He's only one of a number of big players in the group, and there's no way they'd all bow to his will and patronize only the two "majors" because he felt like it. I wasn't in on the meetings, so I can only theorize.

 

He had the chance to say it was speculation and simply his opinion, but for some reason he chose to peddle it as fact.

 

To my knowledge, CAC has never publicized their exact pass/fail rate. Without this information, it is impossible to be precise, but those with lots of experience submitting get a feel for rates of success across the different series. The opinions presented here regarding Saints, Mercs, Barbers, and commems is in-line with my own observations.

I have had submissions with 17/20 success rates and others with 1/12. I personally believe it has something to do with the quality of coin you send them.

The only series I know in depth is Peace dollars. For those, I've acquired an understanding of what NGC values, what PCGS values, what CAC values, and what the greater market values. In broad generalities, CAC favors originality even when eye appeal isn't great, PCGS loves luster and will forgive some hits if the coin beams. They dislike ugly color more than NGC. I favor luster but require a clean cheek & eagle. The market favors blast white & dipped coins. Little oddities of preference like this exist in every series.

 

Its not really a secret some series and some grade ranges are much harder to get stickers than others.

 

Please tell us where you get this information and what specific series and what specific grades.

 

CBD,

Submit a few hundred coins and you'll get a feel for it too. Just like learning how to grade, there's no shortcut for real-world experience.

 

This post makes zero sense, honestly. Why would anyone send just any coin to CAC? I have sent around 200 coins to CAC. But when I do, I try to be careful not to send coins that I think have been dipped or have marks or are weak for the grade, etc.

Finding "the grade range that stickers more often," according to @baseball21, is impossible to prove, and pure speculation because it all depends on the qualities of the individual coins.

All he knows is the simple pop report and the results of the coins he sent in himself. But for some unknown reason he keeps insisting that he is knowledgeable of the patterns and inner workings of CAC.

 

Well, you see, now you're the one that's underestimating; namely, the "marketing," or "promotional" slant. These are promoters. They'd be promoting credit default swaps if they were bright enough to know what the hell those were. There's no "perhaps" this or "perhaps" that about it. They're restricting their endorsements to only those two so only those two are perceived as the most highly-regarded and consequently get the most business. It's like that one who comes around here with her pictures, who's she kidding? They're all playing us. Like a violin.

 

That happened before they formed.

 

Late to this thread. It should be very interesting. However, I believe the original post shows a lack of knowledge about the MS grades and CAC. Endeavor, posted: "The supposed idea of CAC stickers is to get an opinion on whether a coin is on the high end of a grade and therefore justify a premium." This is news to me. I thought a CAC sticker indicated "solid-for-the-grade."

"However, with Mint State having 10 grades alone, isn't a CAC sticker pretty much pointless when the differences are so minute among the MS grades?

This is total nonsense! While "liners" exist, there is a huge difference between each MS grade. Someone needs to read the ANA grading guide or take Grading 101.

"Wouldn't a CAC sticker be more appropriate among G, VG, VF or grades lower on the grading scale?"

Probably yes, as there seems to be more "wiggle room" for opinion and mistakes in these grades. Unfortunately, the value of most coins in lower grade does not rate the added expense.

I have nothing good to say about the majority of statements in these posts either.

 

I asked this once before, but it was missed, so I will ask again. Does CAC bean 1st gen NGC or PCGS, or even 2nd gen? If so, can someone provide a link or pic?

 

Yes, of course:

 

Who graded those? If that's really 1st or 2nd Gen NGC or PCGS slabs, my point is proven. He had a hand in grading those coins, then gave a CAC bean to them. He gave his opinion first, then took money and gave his same opinion to confirm his first opinion. CAC is worthless. The slabs don't even say who graded them. Yet he won't bean an ANACS slab?