Log in or Sign up
Coin Talk
Home
Forums
>
Coin Forums
>
Ancient Coins
>
Another Tyche/Orontes Provincial from Antioch
>
Reply to Thread
Message:
<p>[QUOTE="DonnaML, post: 5425996, member: 110350"][USER=97383]@Al Kowsky[/USER], it seems that one expert who hasn't been in agreement that the Tyche/Orontes tets like mine were from Antioch is David Sear, who, as I mentioned above, attributed the type to Tyre in his <i>Greek Imperial Coinage. </i>What the basis was for that attribution, and whether he's changed his mind since 1982, I have no idea. (By the way, the Augustus tet I posted isn't mine, unfortunately. The image is of the coin illustrating the type at RPC.)</p><p><br /></p><p>I do have one Trajan Provincial tetradrachm generally attributed to Tyre. Note that it also has an eagle and club on the obverse:</p><p><br /></p><p>Trajan AR Tetradrachm, 100 AD, Phoenicia, Tyre. Obv. Laureate head of Trajan right; behind, ear of grain in left field; to right, club in right field; below, eagle with folded wings standing right, ΑΥΤΟΚΡ ΚΑΙϹ ΝΕΡ ΤΡΑΙΑΝΟϹ ϹΕΒ ΓΕΡΜ / Rev. Laureate bust of Melqart (as Herakles) right, lion’s skin tied at neck, ΔΗΜΑΡΧ ΕΞ ΥΠΑΤ Γ [= COS III]. RPC [<i>Roman Provincial Coinage</i>] Vol. III 3526 (2015); RPC Online at <a href="https://rpc.ashmus.ox.ac.uk/coins/3/3526" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="https://rpc.ashmus.ox.ac.uk/coins/3/3526" rel="nofollow">https://rpc.ashmus.ox.ac.uk/coins/3/3526</a>; Prieur 1482 [Prieur, Michel and Karin, <i>Syro-Phoenician Tetradrachms</i> (London, 2000)]; McAlee 452 [McAlee, Richard, <i>The Coins of Roman Antioch</i> (2007)]. 27 mm., 14.25 g.</p><p><br /></p><p>[ATTACH=full]1235634[/ATTACH]</p><p><br /></p><p>I imagine that the attribution of this coin to Tyre didn't present any issues, given Melqart's specific association (as I understand it) with Tyre and Phoenicia. But the Tyche/Orontes tet I posted isn't the only Trajan Provincial coin for which there's been uncertainty as to the place of minting. Not surprising, I suppose, when there's no ethnic giving the location as part of the legend.</p><p><br /></p><p>For example, my Trajan Provincial drachm with a camel on the reverse was apparently attributed originally to Caesarea in Cappadocia (according to Sydenham's 1933 book), and then for many years to a mint in Arabia Bostra. But a 2015 article by Woytek and Butcher argues that these drachms were actually minted in Rome.</p><p><br /></p><p>Trajan AR Drachm, 115-Feb. 116 AD [<i>before granting of Parthia title</i>], Arabia Bostra (or Rome*) Mint. Obv. Laureate, draped and cuirassed bust of Trajan right, with paludamentum, seen from rear, AYTOKP KAIC NЄP TPAIANѠ APICTѠ CƐB ΓƐPM ΔAK [<i>equivalent of IMP CAES NER TRAIANO OPTIMO AVG GERM DAC</i>] / Rev. Bactrian (two-humped) camel, walking left, ΔHMAPX ЄΞ YΠATO ς [<i>equivalent of TR P COS VI (sixth consulship)</i>]. RPC [<i>Roman Provincial Coinage</i>] Vol. III 4076 (2015); RPC Online at <a href="https://rpc.ashmus.ox.ac.uk/coins/3/4076" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="https://rpc.ashmus.ox.ac.uk/coins/3/4076" rel="nofollow">https://rpc.ashmus.ox.ac.uk/coins/3/4076</a>, SNG ANS VI 1158; Sydenham 205 [E. Sydenham, <i>The Coinage of Caesarea in Cappadocia </i>(1933)]. 19 mm., 3.10 g. <i>Purchased from Kenneth W. Dorney</i>. (<i>Coin is double die match to Roma Numismatics Auction, May 21, 2013, Lot 767 [<a href="https://www.numisbids.com/n.php?p=lot&sid=474&lot=767];" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="https://www.numisbids.com/n.php?p=lot&sid=474&lot=767];" rel="nofollow">https://www.numisbids.com/n.php?p=lot&sid=474&lot=767];</a> image of that coin is reproduced as Plate 14, No. 7 in Woytek & Butcher article cited in note below.</i>)</p><p><br /></p><p>[ATTACH=full]1235638[/ATTACH]</p><p> See Bernhard E. Woytek and Kevin Butcher, <i>The Camel Drachms of Trajan in Context: Old Problems and a New Overstrike</i>, The Numismatic Chronicle Vol. 175 (2015), pp. 117-136 (<a href="https://www.jstor.org/stable/43859784" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="https://www.jstor.org/stable/43859784" rel="nofollow">https://www.jstor.org/stable/43859784</a>).[/QUOTE]</p><p><br /></p>
[QUOTE="DonnaML, post: 5425996, member: 110350"][USER=97383]@Al Kowsky[/USER], it seems that one expert who hasn't been in agreement that the Tyche/Orontes tets like mine were from Antioch is David Sear, who, as I mentioned above, attributed the type to Tyre in his [I]Greek Imperial Coinage. [/I]What the basis was for that attribution, and whether he's changed his mind since 1982, I have no idea. (By the way, the Augustus tet I posted isn't mine, unfortunately. The image is of the coin illustrating the type at RPC.) I do have one Trajan Provincial tetradrachm generally attributed to Tyre. Note that it also has an eagle and club on the obverse: Trajan AR Tetradrachm, 100 AD, Phoenicia, Tyre. Obv. Laureate head of Trajan right; behind, ear of grain in left field; to right, club in right field; below, eagle with folded wings standing right, ΑΥΤΟΚΡ ΚΑΙϹ ΝΕΡ ΤΡΑΙΑΝΟϹ ϹΕΒ ΓΕΡΜ / Rev. Laureate bust of Melqart (as Herakles) right, lion’s skin tied at neck, ΔΗΜΑΡΧ ΕΞ ΥΠΑΤ Γ [= COS III]. RPC [[I]Roman Provincial Coinage[/I]] Vol. III 3526 (2015); RPC Online at [URL]https://rpc.ashmus.ox.ac.uk/coins/3/3526[/URL]; Prieur 1482 [Prieur, Michel and Karin, [I]Syro-Phoenician Tetradrachms[/I] (London, 2000)]; McAlee 452 [McAlee, Richard, [I]The Coins of Roman Antioch[/I] (2007)]. 27 mm., 14.25 g. [ATTACH=full]1235634[/ATTACH] I imagine that the attribution of this coin to Tyre didn't present any issues, given Melqart's specific association (as I understand it) with Tyre and Phoenicia. But the Tyche/Orontes tet I posted isn't the only Trajan Provincial coin for which there's been uncertainty as to the place of minting. Not surprising, I suppose, when there's no ethnic giving the location as part of the legend. For example, my Trajan Provincial drachm with a camel on the reverse was apparently attributed originally to Caesarea in Cappadocia (according to Sydenham's 1933 book), and then for many years to a mint in Arabia Bostra. But a 2015 article by Woytek and Butcher argues that these drachms were actually minted in Rome. Trajan AR Drachm, 115-Feb. 116 AD [[I]before granting of Parthia title[/I]], Arabia Bostra (or Rome*) Mint. Obv. Laureate, draped and cuirassed bust of Trajan right, with paludamentum, seen from rear, AYTOKP KAIC NЄP TPAIANѠ APICTѠ CƐB ΓƐPM ΔAK [[I]equivalent of IMP CAES NER TRAIANO OPTIMO AVG GERM DAC[/I]] / Rev. Bactrian (two-humped) camel, walking left, ΔHMAPX ЄΞ YΠATO ς [[I]equivalent of TR P COS VI (sixth consulship)[/I]]. RPC [[I]Roman Provincial Coinage[/I]] Vol. III 4076 (2015); RPC Online at [URL]https://rpc.ashmus.ox.ac.uk/coins/3/4076[/URL], SNG ANS VI 1158; Sydenham 205 [E. Sydenham, [I]The Coinage of Caesarea in Cappadocia [/I](1933)]. 19 mm., 3.10 g. [I]Purchased from Kenneth W. Dorney[/I]. ([I]Coin is double die match to Roma Numismatics Auction, May 21, 2013, Lot 767 [[URL]https://www.numisbids.com/n.php?p=lot&sid=474&lot=767];[/URL] image of that coin is reproduced as Plate 14, No. 7 in Woytek & Butcher article cited in note below.[/I]) [ATTACH=full]1235638[/ATTACH] See Bernhard E. Woytek and Kevin Butcher, [I]The Camel Drachms of Trajan in Context: Old Problems and a New Overstrike[/I], The Numismatic Chronicle Vol. 175 (2015), pp. 117-136 ([URL]https://www.jstor.org/stable/43859784[/URL]).[/QUOTE]
Your name or email address:
Do you already have an account?
No, create an account now.
Yes, my password is:
Forgot your password?
Stay logged in
Coin Talk
Home
Forums
>
Coin Forums
>
Ancient Coins
>
Another Tyche/Orontes Provincial from Antioch
>
Home
Home
Quick Links
Search Forums
Recent Activity
Recent Posts
Forums
Forums
Quick Links
Search Forums
Recent Posts
Competitions
Competitions
Quick Links
Competition Index
Rules, Terms & Conditions
Gallery
Gallery
Quick Links
Search Media
New Media
Showcase
Showcase
Quick Links
Search Items
Most Active Members
New Items
Directory
Directory
Quick Links
Directory Home
New Listings
Members
Members
Quick Links
Notable Members
Current Visitors
Recent Activity
New Profile Posts
Sponsors
Menu
Search
Search titles only
Posted by Member:
Separate names with a comma.
Newer Than:
Search this thread only
Search this forum only
Display results as threads
Useful Searches
Recent Posts
More...