Another Countermark I Can't Figure Out - Sardes Apollo & Club

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Marsyas Mike, May 2, 2021.

  1. Marsyas Mike

    Marsyas Mike Well-Known Member

    Usually I don't bid on a countermark unless I have some idea what it is. Unless it is going cheap. Then I buy it anyway.

    This one baffles me. The host coin is the common little AE from Sardes with Apollo and a club in wreath. The countermark is a four-sided (or five-sided?) something in a circle. I've gone through the usual places to find this and I am coming up with nothing. This host coin is not often countermarked (my half-baked theory is that it is too small - most countermarks that I see are on somewhat larger flans; with something this small a countermark becomes almost an overstrike (see Heraclius counterstamps (both sides) from Sicily, which are sometimes basically overstrikes if the flan is small enough).

    Anyway, if somebody can provide any suggestions on what the countermark's "object" might be, it would be helpful. Is there an ancient four-sided (or five-sided) cross that is resembles? A double-boomerang? Star countermarks of various sorts are out there, but nothing that looks like this thing.
    CM - Sardis Apollo & Club star cm Apr 2021 (0a).jpg
    CM - Sardis Apollo & Club star cm Apr 2021 (0det).jpg
    Lydia, Sardes Æ 15
    Civic Issue
    (c. 133 - 1 B.C.)

    Laureate head of Apollo right / [ΣAΡ]ΔI [ANΩN], club, ΩΠAE monogram below.
    Paris AA.GR.12582; Mionnet IV, 656; GRPC Lydia 66. (Host attribution not entirely certain; monogram seemed to match Wildwinds specimen).
    (4.40 grams / 15 mm)
    Countermark: Four-sided object (cross?) in 7 mm circle obverse.

    Thank you. And feel free to post any Sardes countermarks you might have - I'd like to see them. Or any countermarks at all. I adore countermarks.
     
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  3. Ryro

    Ryro Trying to remove supporter status

    Interesting. It looks like a spoke to me.
    Sardes had some lovely coins... when they could get it in flan.
    A swing and a miss:
    IMG_4189.jpg

    Home run!
    IMG_4005(1).JPG
     
  4. Ignoramus Maximus

    Ignoramus Maximus Nomen non est omen.

    I wish I could help with the countermark, but I can't. But I agree with Ryro that they're probably (wheel) spokes rather than a cross.

    An oldie from Sardeis:
    Lydia. Kroisos, 561-546 BC.  Siglos 5.04 gr. 17 mm. Sardeis mint..jpg

    And, since I like countermarks as well, a siglos from the people that took over the Sardeis mint after Kroisos:
    Achaemenid Siglos ser.4. Countermarked.jpg
     
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  5. ominus1

    ominus1 Well-Known Member

    ..i like countermarks...even if i can't id'em..thery're kool man! :)..i got one as a bonus while binging:)D) on Mt. Argaeus coins scotty tribble purse Cappadocia Severus Alex Mt Arg. coins 002.JPG scotty tribble purse Cappadocia Severus Alex Mt Arg. coins 003.JPG

    Severus Alexander provincial Cappadocia bronzes,one with countermark
     
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  6. ominus1

    ominus1 Well-Known Member

    ..ahahaha...i can picture you now calling strikes as an announcer at the mint >< ryro anouncing strikes on coins.jpg
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2021
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  7. Marsyas Mike

    Marsyas Mike Well-Known Member

    Thank you all for your assistance - @Ryro and @Ignoramus Maximus - that "wheel/spoke" suggestion was helpful - although I still haven't found any Sardes countermarks like this, the wheel is a much better description than the "star" I was originally thinking.

    Thanks again!
     
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  8. Marsyas Mike

    Marsyas Mike Well-Known Member

    I don't have a photo of it, but I have one of those Cappadocia countermarks, not as nice as yours. As for the un-countermarked one, I just bought one on eBay that isn't here yet - the ones without countermarks might be more scarce than the one with them? Either way, any coin with a holy mountain on it is a good one!
     
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