ANACS RP/PRooF 70... But Not?

Did,,,,,n,t that guy on the Nickel once say "if you strive for perfection, then one may achieve excellence"

 

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Actually, it is not removed. An informed opinion by the person purchasing or examining EVERY slab at every grade is what counts. Those who know how to grade either agree the coin is correctly graded or under graded and vote with their wallet. The TPGS opinion only makes the job easier/quicker. Anyone disagree?

Buy the coin not the label.

 

I agree to that....I,m a fan of Au58 grade, but all 58s are not the ones I prefer...in fact, I don,t like most, but once in a while a wow coin appears and that,s the one for me...Agree? It,s like the other end of the spectrum from a 70 grade, but the same rules apply.

 

I use a 110X stereo view and haven't found a perfect coin yet.

 

Too bad we don't live close. Give me an unopened, first release monster box, and on a very bad day, I could get at least two dozen past your 110X scope.

If the coins you are looking at are not sealed from the mint, you are probably buying picked over "sucker tubes" as I cannot believe there is a soul on earth more critical of perfection (edge reeding excluded) than myself!

 

Nope, totally agree, in fact. With a major service certified coin, my question upon looking at the coin is generally reduced from "what's the grade," to "do I agree with the number on the label." The next question, "is it priced right," is still the same, of course."

 

I would disagree.
Which is why PCGS and NGC is worth more than ANACS. People buy coins site unseen all the time, not everyone knows how to grade a coin. Some people rely on the tpg because they cant grade if they had to. Not everyone has the time,Eyes or skill other than the oblivious mark or scratch. If you put together a set of ANACS MS70 silver eagles, Looked at every single one till you felt one was worth the grade of a 70. Not only would it take you forever, You or you kids who will inherit them,still would not get more for the set then any old PCGS or NGC set in the same grade.That will not include all the time,skills and effort you put into searching to put the flawless set together,because that would be your opinion.

 

I wonder if this thread would have gone 5 pages and nearly 90 comments (so far) if the tiny divot the OP found was instead hidden somewhere in the folds of cloth surrounding Liberty or on the flag's canton or in the bundle of vegetation she's carrying? I can somewhat understand his disappointment in getting a coin with a mark that most people wouldn't have noticed but if that same mark had been at a different location it's not entirely likely that any fuss would have been made. What I'm saying is that a single "defect" that would be acceptable in one location should be acceptable in any location. For another example, see the area immediately above and below the sun's ray at 3:00 on this "perfect" coin (click to magnify) and also look at the back of Liberty's left hand on the OP's coin. It appears to have numerous die gouges there.

 

The whole point of this hobby is learning that skill.

 

Regardless of our personal feelings on what a 70 is or if it exists...I think it is pretty clear that this coin should not have been graded a 70. That small pinpoint of missing frost the OP pointed out should prevent that in my opinion. However, I feel that there is a much bigger defect on this coin. One that is prominent and unless and I am seeing things...I can't fathom how even ANACS can call this a 70. I know they have a reputation of being the best of the non-top tier TPGs, but to me this seems like a pretty big miss.

The sun appears to have a ton of frost on it...I would imagine some kind of defect in the etching of the die.

Look at the photos below. I have cropped it and compared it to another coin. The coin on the left is the OP's coin, the coin on the right is a raw example that I own.

 

NO!
The point of this hobby is enjoyment, teaching our children. Completing sets. The hunt,the history, the stories, that you can hold it in your hand. Learning what to look for is certainly part of every collection and every series you collect. But to say the whole point of collecting coins is to learn how to grade?

 

I don't mean to put words in @SuperDave's mouth, but I believe he actually meant that you won't get very far in the hobby without learning this skill.

 

I don't think it's possible to determine that from the photos shown. If you're of the "as struck with full strike" camp, then, if the spot was there after the coin was ejected from the collar, it still counts as a 70, because it was either on the die or it's a tiny strike-through.

 

As true as that is...I don't think the issue with the sun allows for it to be a 70.

 

I disagree with you. If you don't have the time or skill, you shouldn't be collecting or dealing coins. This is not a hobby for blind people, either, unfortunately.

While I have bought coins sight unseen (buying over the internet with only images counts), those coins aren't truly sold until I've examined them. I don't buy from people who "don't take returns." In no case did I need a third party grade opinion, but it does come in awfully handy in venues like eBay. I daresay I would probably not be buying on eBay even to the limited extent that I do now, if TPGS were not available.

I wouldn't put together a set of MS70 ASEs that were flawless to a higher standard of magnification than the grading service used simply to get more money for them when I sold. If I were to do that, I would do it for the hunt and the joy of collecting. So, there's the value in it for me.

 

I think you missed this post. The dots on the sun are a reflection. (Unless you meant the strange frostiness... in which case, if that's not a reflection, it has to be on the die, so you know where I stand.)

 

I meant the frost. I said that in my post. So yes it's on the die. You might feel that since it's on the die it's how the coin should be. However this is clearly a die defect and I think most collectors would walk away. Technically it may still qualify as a 70 but I doubt the market would agree.

 

If it were mine, I would post it up on eBay as "Rare 2013 reverse proof ASE 'frozen sun' variety L@@K!" and see what the market had to say about it.

 

Haha. And it'd probably sell.