An Idea of mine.

So Mr. Honesty, have you paid for or returned the books yet? But you want people to send you hundreds of dollars worth of coins and hope that your honest.

 

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I will start a business where people send me their pennies and I will tell them whether they are copper or not for a small fee.

 

I guess the people would go on blind faith.

I mean think of it this way. What if a jewelry store recently hired a new salesman. What if you brought your $39,000 gold rolex (yes, there are rolexes worth this much) to this place to have repaired. You drop it off with the salesman, who puts it on his wrist out of sight, leaves for lunch, and is never seen again?

Or what if you send your gold to a cash for gold place, and an employee steals it? Or what if a thief opens your mailbox, sees the "Cash4Gold" address, and steals your package?

No matter what you do in life, there is always going to be an amount of assumed risk. I've bought coins off forum members on here, that I did not know from adam. They could of taken my money and never gave me anything.

There has been quite a bit of member to member buying and selling on here, and I only know of one instance where a seller was a fraud.

So if you asked me "would I send in $1,000 to $5,000 worth of coins to a person". The answer is yes, because I operate on the intentions of, that most people are honest.

 

The problem Detecto, besides the whole honesty bit, is what service you are providing that makes it remotely worth $19.99.

That is what I was getting at with my beautiful woman scenario, and tgaw with his "I'll tell you if a penny is copper" scenario.

Let's say GDJSMP offered to appraise coins for $19.99. Unless I am greatly mistaken, he would probably get next to no business. The main reason being that for twice that money (give or take) you can get an appraisal that actually matters, as it 1) is generally respected by any coin collector and 2) is guaranteed, i.e. they back their appraisal with their wallet if they are wrong.

And you sir are no GDJSMP. You will receive 0 coins at $19.99 to appraise.

A more interesting question is if you offered your coin appraisal service at $1 apiece. My hunch is that you would still receive 0 coins to appraise. I mean, who is really going to send you coins to appraise? To get to the root of the problem, why would they?

 

If you are someone who knows 0 about coins, and your Grandpa left you a huge cigar box full of old coins, $19.95 is worth the peace of mind.

It would prevent them from taking it to an unscrupulous dealer, and being offered $500 on a coin worth $5,000

 

Most people in this scenario would seek advice locally from family or friends and not send the coins to someone they do not know. Too much risk involved. Also, when people do want an estimated value, they often want to sell and you will need capital to make these purchases. Also, $19.95 is not a lot of money for you. If someone sent you that "cigar box full of old coins," it might take you many hours or days to give them an accurate appraisal. If you posted pics of the coins on CT, you would get too many different opinions. I would think you would need to be an expert grader to do this.

 

I'll have to be really brutally honest here. Unless you have credibility with credentials to back you up, I have to question why I should even donate a penny. Maybe you can do it in your neighbourhood but it's a very, very small niche market. Why should someone online pay 19.95 when he / she can post a picture of their coins on this forum to identify what it is. I believe there has been a couple of cases in this forum where a couple of really scarce coins have been identified - a lot have doubted their authenticities but have guided them to the right path to have them graded. They did turn out to be genuine. Did that cost 19.95 for them to guide them to the right path? No. Can you guarantee their authencity if you are dealing with thousand dollar coins with known counterfeits? Have you had experience with such counterfeits? Handled them?

Envisioning a business idea is good but you cannot just keep on bouncing them here - you will start to burn bridges faster than a rocket taking off especially if you are talking about money. Some might even pinch your genius idea and profit out of it. Confide with a really good friend. At a gloomy economic time like this, people expect more than good value and service - not just some "comments" with little weight.

Unfortunately with a lot of business, there is no short cut and you must really know your fields and dedicate your time and resources. To combine numismatics and business - not only do you really need to know what you are dealing with but also need to understand business ethics and demonstrate it.

And finally, take note of the amount of advices you have received on this forum and classify what's positive and negative. One outcome is clearer than the other. I personally would like to have get paid to voice my opinion considering the intention of the original post. That includes others as well for them to put in time and effort to "appraise" the business idea. Again you can prove us wrong but it's just so easy to speculate and commenting on it instead of doing it.

 

You guess wrong.

That's what a business has liability insurance for. If one of their employees steals a customer's jewelry, their insurance would cover to have it replaced.

Again, it's called liability insurance. If you open this "appraisal business, make sure you have it.

Ever hear the quote from P.T. Barnum?

 

It is truly sad you think people will pay you 20 bucks to appraise a coin.

You even say "I know some people will send in a bunch at once" (or something to that effect).

I think of all of your posts this may be the most absolutely clueless thing you have ever said.

Actually I take that back. Your think tank and other "invention ideas" that would have propelled human civilization 1000 years into the future and made you millions of dollars are more clueless.

However, you do have some experience with the coin industry and know how it (particularly grading and appraising) works. You should know darn well no one is going to pay $20 to appraise a coin, particularly to a relative nobody (you) in the world of numismatics. You have no excuse on this one besides pure thoughtlessness and delusional thinking.

 

Please consider attending the ANA summer seminar where intermediate & advanced grading classes are offered. You get a diploma for each class that you complete at the summer seminar.

http://www.money.org/numismatic-events/summer-seminar.aspx

BTW, folks can walk into almost any coin store & receive an appraisal/offer.

There was an offer on the TV several years ago where a company would send you a little cloth bag & mailer for you to send them your gold. The folks doing the promotion placed ads on TV for what seemed like a couple months. I was told that they never sent anyone money for the gold they received.

 

Exactly, I'm sure one can walk into a coin shop around their town and ask for an honest appraisal for free...and you know that those guys are professionals, they have probably been in the hobby for decades, and have done well enough to own a store. Why would person would opt for a $20 service where they are sending coins to someone with unknown credentials, who they are trusting will not lose their coins in the mail, to give the same opinion that a coin shop owner would probably give for free?

 

This is a simple response to the original "idea" of this thread:

1) Why would someone send their coins to you for $19.95? What are your credentials/qualifications?
2) Why would someone send their coins to any individual who doesn't know how to properly grade coins to assess their coins for them?
3) What would entice someone to send coins to you for a fee when:
A) There are dozens of individuals on Craigslist who will assess their collections for free in their own home or at a store?
B) Grading services (whose opinions matter) will add value to the coin?
4) Would you send your coins to someone who is flagged on ChexSystems, had their Paypal account closed for failure to pay their BillMeLater account, and has multiple accounts in collections for their utility bills?

I'm merely offering thoughts based upon the result of my suggestion to friends that they should get a few coins in their inheritance graded. They asked the following:

1) How do I know they won't steal my coins?
2) How do I know they won't swap out lower grade coins for my coins?
3) How do I know their opinions are correct?
4) If they lose my coins, are they insured/bonded?

These were questions asked about PCGS. The family had no idea who PCGS was/is. Why? They're not coin collectors.

Either your potential client base will be actual collectors, in which case, you'll get no clients due to those in the community knowing of your antics and lifestyle, or your potential client base will be those with absolutely no understanding of the rare coin market, and you'll be asked the same questions posed above.

Focus your efforts on things that might work out positively for you:

1) Get back into college and study hard.
2) Focus on getting higher paying employment, rather than complaining on a coin forum about your financial problems.

 

People will not pay $20 to have just one coin graded.

This service primarily is geared for people who do not know about coins.

Yes, dealers DO offer free appraisals.

However, I think it's quite foolish, as just about any other industry charges for appraisals.

A real estate agent will not appraise your house for free, professional appraisal people will not work for free.

The reason the majority of dealers offer "free appraisals", is because they are looking to buy your coins.

They are not going to charge you, because they make money from the sales.

But...and this is a HUGE but....to the clueless folks who were passed down a collection, there is nothing, and I mean nothing, preventing a dealer from offering you $500 on a coin worth $2,000.

While MOST dealers are honest, a few are not.

If you do not know coins, you can be very easily taken advantage of, this is how the "hotel buyers" thrive.

However, my service is different, your under no obligation to sell. Most people who take collections into dealers are looking to sell.

However, once I do an appraisal, the sender can "shop around" to see which dealer will offer the most.

Since I arming the sender with prices, this totally PREVENTS them from being ripped off.

They know I will not "lowball them", because they have the option of "shopping around" after I send the coins back.

I can tell you one thing....If I knew nothing about coins, and was given a collection, I would happily pay $19.95 to know what things are worth.

That way if the coin has been appraised at $500, and a dealer offers me $50, I can take it to another dealer, and get a better price.

That's the basis of my service, providing complete price guidance to non-collectors so they have the peace of mind knowing they will not be ripped off.

 

It has a lot to do with things, Tim.
While being in debt may not make you a "bad person", it generally displays a lack of financial responsibility on one's part. I would rather have my coins examined by someone who is responsible with their money rather than by someone who has been banned from using services like paypal due to past issues.

Right, but what about going to a local dealer? Surely they aren't going to steal your coins right in front of you...

Horrible analogy. If you steal my coins, I have your mailing address and contact info to give to the cops.

I sure hope you opt for delivery confirmation on sending the coins back, Tim, instead of playing "pin the blame on someone else"...

When you first proposed the idea in this thread, I thought "OK, sounds a little far-fetched, but if he works at it, maybe it would work". But after reading your responses to the questions, I am having serious doubts that this would EVER work for you.

 

To be fair, this is not always true. While one may be able to get an opinion or assessment on one or a few coins, an in-depth and time consuming appraisal is highly unlikely to come free or without strings. There can be a lot of work involved, and anyone who has ever done one will understand why it is not always so simple; as with anything in life, you pay for what you get, and is the very reason Tim's little idea is doomed to fail. As usual, he is putting the cart before the horse, and if what he has shown here is any indication of his abilities, he is wholly unprepared to even think of offering such services.

 

This is because other businesses (banks, insurers, lenders) rely upon the appraisal information for determining security value on the property. No bank is going to accept Tim Godsil's opinion as a basis for lending against a secured asset or valuation for insurance purposes. Analogies only work when they're at least reasonably related. Your analogy is that two completely different industries might charge fees for appraisals.

No one is under any obligation to sell when they take their coins to dealers, either. There is no legal basis for a dealer saying "Here's $50, I'm taking the coins." Also, your service relies upon the assumption that individuals who get the coins and know nothing about coins are seeking your opinion... to sell them. I still think others who say you're doing what a dealer does for free (when applicable) are right.

I agree in principle with your statement. That said, you aren't exactly an individual qualified to make such assessments. You don't have credentials (that you've told us about) from the ANA, PNG or anyone else. As for the applicability of your creditworthiness to this venture, I think it's very important, as you would need to be bonded, and if you have no assets and lots of overdue liabilities, your risk profile will be extreme. You'll either be very expensive to insure or non-insurable.

Think of it this way:

If you're sent $250k worth of coins (won't happen, but for argument's sake...) and "lose" them, you'll owe the owners whatever they claimed they sent you. The insurance company would need to be willing to take on that risk. Given your history, they might make you bond yourself at $100k and cover the additional $150k at a 10% annual premium. Maybe more. Most likely, they'll just say their actuaries declined to take on your risk.

However, once I do an appraisal, the sender can "shop around" to see which dealer will offer the most.

 

I am going to start a business and have people send me their coins for appraisal, and I am only going to charge 19.99. I have a modest numismatic library and a couple of price guides, and the resources of these forums, and other online resources that anyone else with a computer has, and even though I still post on this forum asking questions about certain coins from time to time that I know nothing about, I still know "quite a bit" about identifying coins. This is a GENIUS idea/business plan that only I could come up with and succeed at..

This is kind of what I feel lke I am hearing/reading in this thread. I could be wrong, but that's how I feel about it. I feel like this kid is always looking for a 'get rich quick' scheme.

 

See a need, fill a need.
No need, need not.

Your target market is people who don't know about coins? When generally the first thing they will do once they have those coins is either sell without any research. Or they will come to a website just like this one and end up posting the coins and getting free advice. How exactly in that process do you think you can sway them to instead send their coins to a random person on the internet for appraisal. Especially a person with no credentials or certifications except maybe a self created website that they will also have to pay and trust them with the coins. Just don't see it happening when plenty of other people will help them free without the coin ever leaving their possession. I don't believe anyone is going to end up sending you coins for appraisal they will either sell or end up sticking with the free advice offered online.

 

Post #3 should have ended this thread. And yet it won't seem to die. I'll add to it, just because Bones hasn't quite recorded enough for me to watch the DVR without fear of commercials.

I would say your business plan puts the cart before the horse. You, as a fairly young person with little to no experience in the field and no references, want to offer appraisal services for average folks and charge a monumental fee to do it. You then use these monumental fees to start a part time coin shop.

Why not instead find something to do to get your seed money (read: a job), start your part time coin shop, run it for, oh- 15 years? That ought to get you the experience to justify this fee. Then, consider the appraisal service. And if you hope to have any respect in the appraisal field, you must never offer to buy the coins - perhaps broker them or prepare them for sale, but never to buy and subsequently sell for profit. It's not fraud, but it doesn't take much to get there. But you can argue those subtleties with your cell mate...