Log in or Sign up
Coin Talk
Home
Forums
>
Coin Forums
>
Ancient Coins
>
A unique tiny coin from Lampsakos?
>
Reply to Thread
Message:
<p>[QUOTE="Severus Alexander, post: 2837837, member: 84744"]I have popped this coin into a couple of threads, but never with an ID. The seller didn't know what it was, and neither did I, but a bit of sleuthing has nailed it, I think. Here it is:</p><p><br /></p><p>[ATTACH=full]670612[/ATTACH] </p><p>It is tiny: 6mm and 0.18 g, which puts it into tetartemorion territory. (The seller listed the weight as 0.02g (!) so I thought it was going to be even smaller... and super fragile. 0.18g seems robust by comparison.)</p><p><br /></p><p>[ATTACH=full]670613[/ATTACH] </p><p>I figured it must be from Lampsakos, due to its similarity to coins like <a href="https://cngcoins.com/Coin.aspx?CoinID=219567" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="https://cngcoins.com/Coin.aspx?CoinID=219567" rel="nofollow">this drachm</a>. However, it lacks a janiform head on the obverse. I finally managed to find a <a href="https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=3781266" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=3781266" rel="nofollow">few</a> <a href="https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=2579042" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=2579042" rel="nofollow">small</a> <a href="https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=3346054" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=3346054" rel="nofollow">fractions</a> that are very <a href="http://www.asiaminorcoins.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pid=11208" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.asiaminorcoins.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pid=11208" rel="nofollow">similar</a>, dating to the 5th century BC. The sellers list them as uncatalogued, but 5 of the 7 are attributed to Lampsakos (the other two to "uncertain in Asia Minor"). The one major difference between these and my coin is that they always feature Athena's head to the <b>left</b> on the reverse, which was standard for the 5th c. BC:</p><p>[ATTACH=full]670638[/ATTACH] </p><p>So what gives with the head right? Just a rare variety? There may be more to it than that. Lampsakos <b>did</b> produce some (larger) Athena head right coins, but as far as I can gather, not until the beginning of the 4th century BC. As it happens, this is just around the time that Greek city states started to ditch their tiny silver fractions in favour of bronze coins (with the exception of a stubborn Athens). So we find Athena head right on Lampsakos <a href="https://agoraauctions.com/listing/viewdetail/31621/107" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="https://agoraauctions.com/listing/viewdetail/31621/107" rel="nofollow">diobols</a> dating as early as 400 to 390 BC, but nothing smaller, as far as I can tell. Meanwhile, <a href="https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=2404514" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=2404514" rel="nofollow">small bronze coins</a> appear at the same time, also with Athena head right and a janiform head.</p><p><br /></p><p>What this means, I think, is that my coin likely dates to the period at the very end of the production of tiny silver fractions, just before the transition to bronze... but after Lampsakos began using Athena head right in their designs. This would put it right around 400 BC, maybe +/- 10 years or so, and would help explain its rarity. These silver fractions from Lampsakos are very rare in the first place, but as far as I can tell my coin is unique. (If that's right, it's doubly unique since it's my only unique type! <img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie31" alt=":cat:" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" />) So the coin is of some numismatic interest, both for its uniqueness, and as one of the last silver fractions.</p><p><br /></p><p>I also find it of historical interest due to the momentous events surrounding its issue. Lampsakos, a wealthy and strategically important city in the northern Troad, was part of the Delian league aka the Athenian empire. Following Athens' catastrophic defeat in Syracuse (413 BC), a number of Delian league members went into revolt, including Lampsakos in 411 BC. This revolt was put down by force, but Athens went on to lose the Peloponnesian War in 404 BC. The league was dissolved under Spartan direction, in alliance with Persia, and Lampsakos immediately came under Persian domination (until its "liberation" many decades later by Alexander the Great).</p><p><br /></p><p>That's a lot to pack into 0.18 g of silver! I had a lot of fun with it, as you can probably tell. <img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie1" alt=":)" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" /> I would welcome any critiques of my reasoning, or examples of the type in references I don't have. (Even if that bursts my "wow, I've got a unique coin!" bubble.) And please post your coins of Lampsakos! Preferably with approximate dates, but whatever![/QUOTE]</p><p><br /></p>
[QUOTE="Severus Alexander, post: 2837837, member: 84744"]I have popped this coin into a couple of threads, but never with an ID. The seller didn't know what it was, and neither did I, but a bit of sleuthing has nailed it, I think. Here it is: [ATTACH=full]670612[/ATTACH] It is tiny: 6mm and 0.18 g, which puts it into tetartemorion territory. (The seller listed the weight as 0.02g (!) so I thought it was going to be even smaller... and super fragile. 0.18g seems robust by comparison.) [ATTACH=full]670613[/ATTACH] I figured it must be from Lampsakos, due to its similarity to coins like [URL='https://cngcoins.com/Coin.aspx?CoinID=219567']this drachm[/URL]. However, it lacks a janiform head on the obverse. I finally managed to find a [URL='https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=3781266']few[/URL] [URL='https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=2579042']small[/URL] [URL='https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=3346054']fractions[/URL] that are very [URL='http://www.asiaminorcoins.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pid=11208']similar[/URL], dating to the 5th century BC. The sellers list them as uncatalogued, but 5 of the 7 are attributed to Lampsakos (the other two to "uncertain in Asia Minor"). The one major difference between these and my coin is that they always feature Athena's head to the [B]left[/B] on the reverse, which was standard for the 5th c. BC: [ATTACH=full]670638[/ATTACH] So what gives with the head right? Just a rare variety? There may be more to it than that. Lampsakos [B]did[/B] produce some (larger) Athena head right coins, but as far as I can gather, not until the beginning of the 4th century BC. As it happens, this is just around the time that Greek city states started to ditch their tiny silver fractions in favour of bronze coins (with the exception of a stubborn Athens). So we find Athena head right on Lampsakos [URL='https://agoraauctions.com/listing/viewdetail/31621/107']diobols[/URL] dating as early as 400 to 390 BC, but nothing smaller, as far as I can tell. Meanwhile, [URL='https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=2404514']small bronze coins[/URL] appear at the same time, also with Athena head right and a janiform head. What this means, I think, is that my coin likely dates to the period at the very end of the production of tiny silver fractions, just before the transition to bronze... but after Lampsakos began using Athena head right in their designs. This would put it right around 400 BC, maybe +/- 10 years or so, and would help explain its rarity. These silver fractions from Lampsakos are very rare in the first place, but as far as I can tell my coin is unique. (If that's right, it's doubly unique since it's my only unique type! :cat:) So the coin is of some numismatic interest, both for its uniqueness, and as one of the last silver fractions. I also find it of historical interest due to the momentous events surrounding its issue. Lampsakos, a wealthy and strategically important city in the northern Troad, was part of the Delian league aka the Athenian empire. Following Athens' catastrophic defeat in Syracuse (413 BC), a number of Delian league members went into revolt, including Lampsakos in 411 BC. This revolt was put down by force, but Athens went on to lose the Peloponnesian War in 404 BC. The league was dissolved under Spartan direction, in alliance with Persia, and Lampsakos immediately came under Persian domination (until its "liberation" many decades later by Alexander the Great). That's a lot to pack into 0.18 g of silver! I had a lot of fun with it, as you can probably tell. :) I would welcome any critiques of my reasoning, or examples of the type in references I don't have. (Even if that bursts my "wow, I've got a unique coin!" bubble.) And please post your coins of Lampsakos! Preferably with approximate dates, but whatever![/QUOTE]
Your name or email address:
Do you already have an account?
No, create an account now.
Yes, my password is:
Forgot your password?
Stay logged in
Coin Talk
Home
Forums
>
Coin Forums
>
Ancient Coins
>
A unique tiny coin from Lampsakos?
>
Home
Home
Quick Links
Search Forums
Recent Activity
Recent Posts
Forums
Forums
Quick Links
Search Forums
Recent Posts
Competitions
Competitions
Quick Links
Competition Index
Rules, Terms & Conditions
Gallery
Gallery
Quick Links
Search Media
New Media
Showcase
Showcase
Quick Links
Search Items
Most Active Members
New Items
Directory
Directory
Quick Links
Directory Home
New Listings
Members
Members
Quick Links
Notable Members
Current Visitors
Recent Activity
New Profile Posts
Sponsors
Menu
Search
Search titles only
Posted by Member:
Separate names with a comma.
Newer Than:
Search this thread only
Search this forum only
Display results as threads
Useful Searches
Recent Posts
More...