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<p>[QUOTE=&quot;dougsmit, post: 2340841, member: 19463&quot;]For those of us who collect coins made by old methods, wires can be classed as the &#039;last ancients&#039; regardless of their late date.&nbsp; Ivan IV&#039;s coins were pretty well made compared to some reigns and the really rare, early or local issues can be really crude looking.&nbsp; Why wire?&nbsp; It was relatively easy to draw a wire through a die of accurate thickness so cutting a specific length would produce blanks of consistent weight.&nbsp; Striking them so they got detail on flan was another matter.&nbsp; The worst are probably the last of Peter I where it might take half a dozen to reconstruct the entire design.&nbsp; Unlike ancients, the dies were made from hubs so it is not at all unusual to find coins that appear to be from the same dies.&nbsp; Actually they are probably just from different dies from the same hub.&nbsp; I learned this when I feared I was seeing fakes since there were too many die duplicates according to my ancient experience. I am not saying there are no fakes; I am not expert enough to know. </p><p><br /></p><p>There are some Russian sellers of these on eBay that offer all ranges of rarity and price.&nbsp; I have trouble believing the prices of the high end ones.&nbsp; All mine are beginners&#039; models but you may have to sort through a pile to find them any more complete.&nbsp; YOC&#039;s coin is a nice one.</p><p><br /></p><p>Ivan IV as Grand duke AR denga (half kopeck)</p><p>[ATTACH=full]475631[/ATTACH] </p><p>another</p><p>[ATTACH=full]475632[/ATTACH] </p><p>a third</p><p>[ATTACH=full]475633[/ATTACH] </p><p>Ivan IV as Tsar kopeck (with spear)</p><p>[ATTACH=full]475634[/ATTACH] </p><p>Boris Godinov kopeck </p><p>[ATTACH=full]475635[/ATTACH] </p><p>Mikhail Fyodorovich Romanov kopeck</p><p>[ATTACH=full]475636[/ATTACH] </p><p>another</p><p>[ATTACH=full]475637[/ATTACH] </p><p><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexis_I_of_Russia" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexis_I_of_Russia" rel="nofollow">Alexei Mikhailovich</a> AE kopeck of the Copper Riot - interesting story about what happens when you mess with the money.&nbsp; This one is not the worst I&#039;ve seen.</p><p><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copper_Riot" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copper_Riot" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copper_Riot</a></p><p>[ATTACH=full]475638[/ATTACH] </p><p>Peter I kopeck - small and thick</p><p>[ATTACH=full]475639[/ATTACH] </p><p>another (and about as full flan as I have seen) -&nbsp; Some of these are year dated under the horse but getting the date well struck is not common unless you are willing to give up having the rider on flan.&nbsp; This may be 1699. This coin is .01g lighter than the smaller one above but it was just hit harder so it spread out wider.</p><p>[ATTACH=full]475640[/ATTACH][/QUOTE]</p><p><br /></p>

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