A question about Restoration Methods

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by john1942sept, Apr 22, 2014.

  1. statequarterguy

    statequarterguy Love Pucks

    Bottom line is, since you didn't acquire the coin from the mint/bank, you don't know what's been done to it. It clearly has not aged well and has issues.
     
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  3. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    There's 3 basic possibilities: PVC residue, verdigris, or some kind of green organic material. It doesn't look like verdigris. Organic material decays and would not stay green. That means that there is a high probability that it is PVC residue.

    Acetone will answer the question because acetone will dissolve and remove it if it is PVC residue, it will do nothing to it if it is verdigris, and it will likely do nothing to it if it is organic.
     
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  4. BadThad

    BadThad Calibrated for Lincolns

    Actually, acetone is a polar, organic solvent so many organic compounds WILL dissolve in acetone, especially if the carbon chain is on the short side. For the longer chain organic compounds the best choice is xylene.

    In general, all conservation projects should follow the Polarity Ladder: water, acetone and then xylene if the first two fail.
     
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  5. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Thad we've been saying the same thing for as long as I can remember. But when it comes to organics, distilled water is usually the best. Yeah acetone might dissolve some of them, but as a general rule it doesn't work too good on them.
     
  6. john1942sept

    john1942sept Member

    GDJMSP:

    You're saying the longer the green stays on the more damage will occur. That's a good nugget.

    It could be PVC and not from coin flips. We have another newer group of coins that the son of the woman hoarded. They were found in 1985 in a gallon bucket full of silver coins that the son hoarded. A few of them were also covered in this green.
     
  7. john1942sept

    john1942sept Member

    Thad:

    Are there other items if water, acetone and xylene all fail? Do you apply xylene in the same manner?
     
  8. Kentucky

    Kentucky Well-Known Member

    Uh...no. Water is a miserable solvent for almost all organics, that is unless you put in some soap or surfactant, which I know you hate. Acetone is really the most universal solvent for most organics. If they resist acetone, could try xylene. BTW, toluene is really good too, if you don't mind the smell.
     
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  9. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    I dunno Kentucky, I'm no chemist. But as the saying goes - like dissolves like. And since most organic substances are, well, based on water ..............

    And based on my personal experience acetone has always done a lousy job of loosening or removing ordinary dirt and grime that all coins pick up, often it does nothing even. But water has always done a better job of it.
     
  10. Conder101

    Conder101 Numismatist

    Actually all organics are based on carbon molecule chains (No carbon based molecules, not organic) which is why the carbon based solvents like acetone, and xylene work so well.
     
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  11. Kentucky

    Kentucky Well-Known Member

    Agree with you that water is good for ordinary dirt and grime, but dirt and grime are not organic, they are inorganic. Organic is stuff like grease, oil, fingerprints, paint, etc. Acetone is better for them (or xylene or toluene).
     
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  12. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    OK, but I disagree with ya about ordinary dirt and grime is. What's dirt ? It's decayed plant material for the most part (topsoil anyway) and plants are organic. And plain ordinary dirt, combined with body oils from people's fingers and all the dirt that sticks to their fingers, is what almost all of the dirt and grime on coins comes from.

    But like I said, I'm not trying to argue chemistry or what stuff is made of. My primary point is that what I have seen with my own eyes is that water works better than acetone on plain old dirty coins. And I've seen it time and time again. And when ya see something with your own eyes enough times you'd usually be smart to believe it's true.
     
  13. BadThad

    BadThad Calibrated for Lincolns

    Indeed...but you have this wrong. Organic molecules are generally insoluble in water unless they are very short-chain and polar. Water is a highly polar solvent and, in chemistry, like dissolves like. Acetone and xylene are best for removing organic residues.
     
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  14. BadThad

    BadThad Calibrated for Lincolns

    There are MANY solvents in the world, just most of them are not available to the average consumer. I stick with recommending solvents that are available to most people and safe to use.

    As far as "application", I always recommend soaking in a glass container with a tight-fitting lid, followed by a rinse with the same fresh, clean solvent.
     
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  15. Kentucky

    Kentucky Well-Known Member

    Not totally disagreeing with you, always start with water.
     
  16. john1942sept

    john1942sept Member

    I have tried acetone and water on wornslick silver quarters that will never be more than silver. Water is a little more effective. It takes off some of green, but not all. This likely has been there for 70 years or so. I have left some coins in acetone for over a week. The tooth pick does take off some spots and acetone appears to make that a little easier.
     
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