A lovely family portrait of the Severans!

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by JayAg47, Sep 4, 2020.

  1. JayAg47

    JayAg47 Well-Known Member

    Severans.jpg
    Julia Domna- Vestae Sanctae 197 AD, RIC 587
    Septimius Severus- Virt Avgg, 200-201 AD, Virtus standing holding Victory and spear, RIC 171a.
    Geta as Caesar- Felicitas Pvblica, 203 AD, RIC 38a
    Caracalla as Caesar- Spei Perpertvae, 196 AD, RSC 597

    sev rev.jpg
     
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  3. Andres2

    Andres2 Well-Known Member

    poor Geta, killed and removed from the the family picture :(
    luckily many Geta coins remain.

    P1160797 (2).JPG P1160287cleaned.jpg P1170772 201 -206 AD born 188 died 217.jpg Geta as Caesar.JPG
     
  4. ominus1

    ominus1 Well-Known Member

    ..kool..imma fan of family portraits meself...:) (Erin owns the Julia on the bottom right) Sept. Severus AR denarius...and family 004.JPG
     
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2020
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  5. Al Kowsky

    Al Kowsky Well-Known Member

    I'm still missing a good looking coin of mom :(.

    1883246-009, AK Collection.jpg
    NGC 2101304-006, AK Collection.jpg
    2420232-002, AK Collection.jpg
     
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  6. zumbly

    zumbly Ha'ina 'ia mai ana ka puana

    Dad and the boys...
    Septimius Prusa 00447Q00.JPG SEPTIMIUS SEVERUS
    AE29. 11.18g, 28.8mm. BITHYNIA, Prusias ad Hypium, circa AD 197/8. RecGen -; BMC -; SNG von Aulock -; SNG Cop -; ISEGRIM -. O: ΑΥΤ Κ Λ ΣΕΠΤΙ ΣΕΟΥΗΡΟΣ Π, Laureate, draped and cuirassed bust right. R: ΕΙΣ ΕΩΝΑ ΤΟΥ-Σ Κ-ΥΡ-ΙΟΣ / ΠΡΟΥΣΙΕΩΝ, Septimius Severus, in military attire, standing front, head to left, holding scepter in his left hand and clasping his right hand with Caracalla, on the left, standing right in miltary attire and holding scepter in his left; on the right, Geta, togate, standing front, head to left, holding patera in his right hand and scroll (?) in his left.
    Notes: Unpublished in the standard references and possibly unique.

    Mum and the boys...
    Julia Domna - Geta Caracalla 681.jpg JULIA DOMNA
    AE Dupondius. 14.06g, 26.1mm. Rome mint, AD 198. RIC 886 (R2); Cohen 159; BMC 793. O: IVLIA AVGVSTA, draped bust right. R: PIETATI AVGVSTAE, Julia Domna standing facing between Geta and Caracalla, who hold a globe between them; Caracalla, togate, standing front, head to right, holding roll in his left hand; Geta standing front, in military attire, head to left, holding spear with his left hand; S C in exergue.
    Ex G.G. Collection; ex Roma IV, 30 September 2012, lot 2795

    Play got rough, and Geta got erased...
    Caracalla - Stratonicaea AE38 Geta Damnatio 2510.jpg CARACALLA [with GETA]
    Medallic AE. 28.75g, 38mm. CARIA, STRATONICAEA, circa AD 209-211. Epitynchanontos, prytanis. SNG von Aulock –; SNG Copenhagen –; SNG München –; SNG Tübingen –; cf. CNG 100, lot 1728; for c/m: Howgego 84. O: [AV K M AVP] ANTΩ[NINOC C Λ CЄ ΓЄTA]C K, Confronted busts of [Geta – erased as result of damnatio memoriae] right and Caracalla left, both laureate, draped, and cuirassed; c/m: Bust of Caracalla right within incuse circle. R: ЄΠI ΠPV ЄΠITVNKANONTOC Γ ΦΙΛΩNOC CTPAT[ONIKЄΩN], Hecate standing facing, head left, sacrificing from patera [over altar] and holding torch.
     
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  7. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

  8. Limes

    Limes Well-Known Member

    Dad:
    28.1.png
    Mom and Geta:
    29.2.png
    About to get killed Geta:
    31.2.png
    The evil son:
    30.2.png
     
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  9. Finn235

    Finn235 Well-Known Member

    Nice set!

    Here's my examples of the Four

    Daddy
    Septimius severus denarius trophy captives.jpg

    Mommy
    Julia Domna Denarius saecvli felicitas.jpg

    Big bro
    20180205_Caracalla-denarius-Liberalitas-VIIII.jpg

    redacted
    Geta augustus fortuna.jpg



    And just for fun, the whole extended dysfunctional family the last time I dragged them all out for a photo
    Severan collection.jpg
     
  10. Macromius

    Macromius Well-Known Member

    I have often wondered about Septimius Severus skin color in that round painting.
     
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  11. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    Macromius, Thank you for that.
    One little detail to watch out for from that otherwise Gee Whiz program that ostensibly recreates Imperial faces. Not only is the technology in its infancy; the algorhythms involved allow for all kinds of implicit bias at the programming level. So what looks objective (a one-word oxymoron ...from a believer in the scientific method, peer review, etc. --and a student of Kierkegaard) really ain't.
    In this context, I've had occasion to wonder if some of the curly hair on Severan portraits wasn't from a salon. Especially in reference to the Antonines, where that's the more likely explanation.
     
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2020
  12. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member

    I see nothing odd for a Mediterranean field general who spent much of his life out in the sun. Julia must have sent much of her time indoors applying makeup.
     
  13. Alegandron

    Alegandron "ΤΩΙ ΚΡΑΤΙΣΤΩΙ..." ΜΕΓΑΣ ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΣ, June 323 BCE

    Here, her makeup is starting to slough off...

    upload_2020-9-4_18-49-5.png
    RI Julia Domna 194-217 Fouree AR Plated Den Isis Horus
     
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  14. Alegandron

    Alegandron "ΤΩΙ ΚΡΑΤΙΣΤΩΙ..." ΜΕΓΑΣ ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΣ, June 323 BCE

    And, here is the rest of the "loving" family...

    upload_2020-9-4_18-50-24.png
    RI Septimus Severus 193-211 AR Denarius Genius Sacrificing


    upload_2020-9-4_18-53-14.png
    RI AR Den Julia Domna 200 CE Felicitas Isis Horus foot on prow rudder against altar behind RIC 577, Ex: @dougsmit via @John Anthony 's Auction


    upload_2020-9-4_18-51-18.png
    RI Caracalla 198-217 AR Denarius MONETA


    upload_2020-9-4_18-51-57.png
    RI Geta AR Denarius 209-211 CE On horse spearing enemy
     
  15. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    The Wiki article about Septimius (remarkably well-documented, for a change) notes the following:
    "Septimius Severus came from a wealthy and distinguished family of equestrian rank. He had Italian Roman ancestry on his mother's side, and was descended from Punic forebears on his father's side. [...] He spoke the local Punic language fluently, but he was also educated in Latin and Greek, which he spoke with a slight accent." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Septimius_Severus#Family_and_education
    Along similar lines, regarding St. Augustine, from the same neck of the woods, a similarly competent Wiki article notes the following.
    "Scholars generally agree Augustine and his family were Berbers, an ethnic group indigenous to North Africa, but were heavily Romanized, speaking only Latin at home as a matter of pride and dignity." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Augustine_of_Hippo#Childhood_and_education
    Regarding the racial composition of northern Africa during Antiquity, one must bear in mind that, especially during an historical interval which was effectively innocent of racism in any recognizably modern, ideological form, there was considerable fluidity, where the operant demographics were concerned. Egypt saw literal millennia of successive occupation and settlement by waves of Asiatic and European invaders, bookended by the Persians and the Ottomans. What would you suppose happened ...with readily available precedent from the US?
     
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2020
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