A heads up - numismatist integrity

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I've said it many times. I used to get shipments from Littleton and while the coins were always problem free, they were always one grade overgraded. Littleton has a reputation for being a strict grader when BUYING, but if you are on the receiving end of what they are selling the grading is a lot looser. At least in my personal experience, and this is with respect to circulated coins.

Because the ultimate choice in whether or not a transaction occurs is up to the buyer. The seller can't MAKE him buy.

Yes, and it is a very commonly made mistake.

 

This cuts both ways. A seller cannot be forced to sell if the price is not of his liking. BOTH parties result in the transaction, not either/or.

To me, it sounds like Littleton offered a fair price. The seller thought they should be worth more since the buyer sells them at a high price. The seller has no right to Littleton's profit margin. As long as Littleton offered a price that is line with other dealers, they have done nothing wrong.

When signing up to collect coins, no one ever guaranteed us a +-5% spread when buying and selling. Dealers have costs, and I see Littleton doing a ton of advertising bringing new collectors to the hobby. That is the upside to us, the downside is the pricing these new collectors might pay to Littleton.

 

If the buyer makes a low counteroffer and the seller agrees and then later realizes he made a mistake it is the sellers fault not the buyers. There is only a transaction when one person accepts an offer and either side can make an offer. It is the responsibility of the person who does the accepting whether it is the buyer or the seller. but it is only the responsibility of one of them.

 

If I may interject... To me the point is not dishonesty, it is simply a discrepancy of price vs. value. From my point of view there are always two numbers on any item. The first is value, this is established in the market and is the most probable amount that a fully informed buyer will pay. Price, however, is the amount that a seller believes that can get for an item to the right buyer.

I feel that the bid that was offered on the coins was based on value. The list price on the website is just that, price. If Littleton wanted to put a price of $3000 on the item, then that is their perogative. As has been said, Littleton is a little overpriced on their items and if someone chose to pay that price, then that is their choice. No one has a gun to their head.

As value goes, there are plenty of people out there willing to pay value for the items that were being offered. The owner doesn't have a gun to his head forcing him to sell to Littleton. If he felt that the price was unfair, he shouldn't sell and instead find someone who will pay his price. That is the other issue, the owner has the right to ask whatever price he wants for the item. He may never sell it, but that price is his choice.

As a real estate appraiser, I see properties all the time that are underpriced and overpriced. When I see a property sell overpriced that just tells me that there was something that compelled a specific buyer to pay that price, regardless of value. For me, when it comes to coins it is my choice to stand on the values listed in the Red Book, however it is also my choice that I have never paid book value for any coin I have ever bought. If the seller is asking book or more, I make the choice to walk away.

I hate when anyone is taken advantage of, but if they have ability to make themselves fully informed and do not then in my mind they are party and one-half responsible for their own downfall. I have heard my whole life that ignorance is not innocence, and anyone should realize that no one is resposible for you but yourself. Just my opinion. (edit: I noticed a post from Feb. from this fellow regarding a "fair eqitable asking price" on these coins and it seems like he had a shoulder chip from the beginning about this.)

 

You know, I reread the original post again, and it seems to me that the issue is not merely the coin market, or free capitalism. I feel that it is probably the fact that his sweetheart has a medical condition (bills) his taxes have gone up (bills) and he has to purchase oil for the winter (another bill), for people on fixed incomes rises in those sort of costs can hit hard, and then if the op has looked at prices that things are being sold for, it stands to reason that perhaps those who charge the highest might also buy at higher prices.

He probably knows all that free marketeer stuff, and probably can recite the free market catechism along with the rest of the choir, but that don't feed the bulldog, I would guess that he is probably a seasoned citizen and just feels a tad overwhelmed with circumstances.

So my advice, would be to forget selling the coins, but get a part time job, so many of todays kids cannot make change, cannot get to work on time and cannot be bothered to do more than the bare minimum, so a part time job might be just what the op needs to get over this little hump.

I may be wrong in my take on this, but it seems to me that the issue we are discussing is only a small part of the whole picture.

 

Though I have never bought from Littleton I have owned many coins that were still in the Littleton packaging packaging when bought as part of collections. The coins were always good solid coins that were pretty close to the grade listed (grading is subjective opinion after all).

The thing that many people don't take into consideration is the cost of all that advertizing AND the monetary losses due to items sent out on approval and "lost in the mail" or not returned for whatever reason. If their pricing was the same as an internet or small brick and mortar store then they would go bankrupt in short order.

As for the "junk" they sell, I do agree that there is no numismatic value added to a coin that has been colorized or plated, but there are some people that actually LIKE the stuff. Who are we to say they are "damaging the hobby" when they are selling product to people that actually want it?

Richard