Got these from the 25 cent bin in my coin shop, two of them have a "40" counterstamp. The dates are 1735, no dates (late 1700's early 1800's) and 1828. The dateless and 1828 are bigger than a Morgan
You are welcome. I am assuming they countermarked their coins to make it a higher denomination. I have never seen that.
Actually the coins are marked down not up. Shown is a pix of an original 80 reis, 1828 Rio, in uncirculated. Following is an 80 reis specimen which has been counterstamped with a 40. You can still see traces of the original "80" under the 40. The counterstamps in Brazil are called "com carimbo" or "with stamp" in the price guides. Usually they halved the value of the coin but for lightweight high value pieces sometimes made it 1/4. My understanding is that the coins were originally struck for circulation elsewhere: in some of the colonies but in order to circulate in Brazil, the value was too high; thus they had to be downgraded. I am having a terrible time obtaining historical info on the coinage history of Brazil. The above came from "As Moedas Contam a Historia do Brazil, 2007. Any good book references would be appreciated. The values vary: sometimes the counterstamped variety is more expensive but usually the original pieces are rarer.
This coin of 1735 was counterstamped too. Is too weak, but if you look between XX you'll realize. This stamp is know as "Carimbo do Escudo"(Stamp of shield), but here, we call "Carimbo do escudete". Was used because after 1800 had an increase in price of copper, and the facial values of the coins was outdated compared of the material price. Because this, was minted new coins after 1800 to correct the weight of copper relative to the facial value of each coin. But the coins before 1799, which had a larger weight, were still in circulation and to equalize the facial value of this old coins to the material price, the king Don João VI made a law declaring that all coin minted before 1799 were stamped with this countermark to duplicate his values. Follow the facial values and the weight of the coins before and after 1800 Before 1800 1) V reis - 3,58 grams 2) X réis - 7,17 grams 3) XX réis - 14,34 grams 4) XL réis - 28,68 grams. After 1800 1) V réis - Was extinct 2) X réis - 3,58 grams 3) XX réis - 7,17 grams 4) XL réis - 14,34 grams 5) LXXX réis - 28,68 grams(new coin). I get this pic in internet to show a coins with a stamp more visible. And this is the original draw of this coat of arms. Ps: Sorry my lack of know to write english and please, let me know if anything that I wrote is hard to understand that I try explain again.
Quite interesting but note that the countermarks decrease, not increase the coin values. If it was a question of increasing copper costs, wouldn't an old 80 reis go up to 160 reis, not down to 40? There is a Brazilian copper specialist who lives in Curitiba , I'll ask him.
Actually it seems there were several series of countermarks. Some increased the value and some decreased it. I think this is what you mean and now it makes sense. Just got back from Brazil where I got a lot of copper from the 1730's, often in excellent condition. Will try to post it. Got a fully mint state 80 reis: the older kind with the "LXXX" instead of the "80" as on the newer ones. Need to photo it when I get the time.
