Log in or Sign up
Coin Talk
Home
Forums
>
Coin Forums
>
Coin Chat
>
A Beginners Guide to Identifying Proof Like Coins: A new technique
>
Reply to Thread
Message:
<p>[QUOTE="LuxUnit, post: 3460560, member: 90324"]As a <i>novice </i>collector, something that I and many others struggle with is identifying a <i>PROOF LIKE</i> (PL) coin. This simple system I developed is a good starting point for understanding the question "Does my coin have a chance at being PL". This does not answer "Is my coin PL". You can also use this technique with slabbed coins unlike the traditional 4" reflection test.</p><p><br /></p><p><u>Just to reiterate by using my technique you can come to two conclusions:</u></p><p>1. My coin <b>MAY BE </b>PL.</p><p>2. My coin <b>IS NOT </b>PL.</p><p><br /></p><p>That's it!</p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p>I call it the <i>LUX REFLECTION TECHNIQUE</i>. Because we will be focusing on <b>light </b>reflection <u>not</u> <b>image </b>reflection like the typical 4" and 8" standards... and Lux is Latin for light! <img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie7" alt=":p" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" /></p><p><br /></p><p><b>FYI</b>: If you don't care about the science skip ahead to where this comes into play or the set up.</p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p><u><b>A Quick understanding of reflections</b></u></p><p><br /></p><p>A little background on reflection and the simple explanation of how it words will help us in determining if a coin MAY be PL.</p><p>The second Law of reflection states: "The angle which the incident ray makes with the normal is equal to the angle which the reflected ray makes to the same normal." As seen below.</p><p><img src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/10/Reflection_angles.svg/800px-Reflection_angles.svg.png" class="bbCodeImage wysiwygImage" alt="" unselectable="on" /> (wiki)</p><p>Simplified it states <i>a ray of light that reflects off of a mirrored surface will reflect off at the same angle that it it originally struck the surface. </i>This is useful information that most of us already understand even if you don't recognize it. For example, if you took a mirror and stood at a 45 degree angle from it you would see a 45 degree reflection of where the mirror is pointing to like looking around a corner or using a periscope. This will later be applied.</p><p><br /></p><p>The second concept of importance is understanding <i>Diffuse </i>reflection vs. <i>Specular </i>reflection. Simply put <b>diffuse reflection</b> is when light hits a non mirror like surface and gives it light reflection and provides the images we see, such as the sun illuminating a grassy field so we can see it. Exactly why we can not see anything in a pitch black room, without objects diffusely reflecting light our eyes could not pick up their images. <b>Specular reflection</b> is what you see in mirrors. An exact replication of the light that shined on the surface is reflected back. Exactly like looking in a mirror.</p><p>By using the information we know about Specular and diffuse reflection we know that if a coin that is more mirror like will give a more specular reflection. And a coin that is less mirror like will give a less defined or diffuse reflection.</p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p><b><u>How collectors currently home test PL coins</u></b></p><p><br /></p><p>The above concept is currently how many collectors determine whether their coin is PL or not, the current home test is to see if your coin reflects an image from 4" or 8" distances. But the problem with this test is how clear does a coin have to be in order for the image to be considered reflected (or specular). And if you attempt to reflect through a slab then the plastic enhances the reflection.</p><p><br /></p><p><b><u>WHERE THIS TECHNIQUE COMES INTO PLAY</u></b></p><p><b><u><br /></u></b></p><p>Rather than using the idea of image reflection, my technique takes into consideration <b>LIGHT </b>reflection (yes images are actually light reflections but for arguments sake lets keep reflected <i>images </i>and reflected <i>light </i>separate). The concept is a metal surface that is more mirror like will reflect light in a less diffuse pattern and a more specular pattern. In order to view how diffuse/specular a coins light reflection is we will now use the second law of reflection. By Shining a light at a coin and holding that coin at a 45 degree angle to that light source you can reflect the light source another 45 degrees downward so the image is exactly 90 degrees onto your table. This should create an exact image of where the coin reflects light vs where it does not. A perfectly reflective coin should have a specular reflection heavily from the fields but not at the devices giving off a mirror image of the fields with a shadowed area of the devices.</p><p><br /></p><p>Secondly, the old technique is impossible to use when wanting to view reflections of images through slabs. But using my technique the reflection of light off the slab does not matter because the amount of light reflected is even on all surfaces therefore if the slab reflects the light making the fields appear more reflective it will also make the devices appear more reflective. This means the contrast between fields and devices is the same ratio regardless of whether there is slab or not. Essentially, you will see the same amount of definition of the devices whether the slab reflects or not.</p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p><u><b>The set up:</b></u></p><p><br /></p><p>100 lumen LED flashlight (any bright light that isn't too diffuse)</p><p>A regular piece of computer paper</p><p><br /></p><p>This example uses 3 coins:</p><p><br /></p><p>1. A dipped mirror like ~63 1882 Morgan</p><p>2. A (near) 64 PL 1879 Morgan</p><p>3. A ~MS 61 1899 Morgan with heavy luster</p><p>(If I had a PL coin or DMPL coin this would be easier, I'm sorry I used what I had available)</p><p><br /></p><p>How to position coin and light</p><p><img src="https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/n6gQ9aTe8pUN3dAxskHea7g4bAjSvoh8WZvcxgIXr2drP9Rxm2Hb-amSVYGHvswFIESEAxQ8w5u1Nmml-0n2-A5pugtKbWdJa_mtNp57ZhEo8MDUpfIQqto-E-hqMAmkcFW7OcaEYVSFE6zEr8I5I6XvoJC1NOuCajQMHSradZNj9_OESSgWoJsqp6ZYGcIw0kApXP8BCNc8Be6C5-bZA4Kyor4kBpyaufLaE8PnIlFe_VfdUFK15BlZmIf4MIt37zx452ZF5-3UBRi3giuhrYUdLCbS48PZPRvsWEt0CBOuOrR4nJF-PpTQhV_OL0DG0zafqxpQ01etmCRlyCB46bBJSexaMxmzRILgWqwgJWz-_ohTI_x6ulX0vcp-AtxNOYT85nLCqcDghWRe7RI5CAsIbC-06-fu3N_vjtX64zgG_QHyheQvmWilaFDaj8r84q7UMU9NhsxEuCjLG9r9jlOk6yuHygVBHDB55AyA9yIJ0eLWWUaim4L9YL0OMJQejnAWDbYLLptJlubHZ5R6Z1PFTg9ut7a1RVzFc8fRgzB79iacdIKxxzuCkVu5RRZdf_Tu_1bLr6Kx2XfiSVVDMCwZDWDdyPah6kUIKkm3esDgghEq6Dx8axyCUBHJ4qvPK-VhpqRyECwYNzCs-optdOX3E0DE3ak=w1205-h904-no" class="bbCodeImage wysiwygImage" alt="" unselectable="on" /></p><p><br /></p><p>Procedure:</p><p>1. Turn off lights</p><p>2. Turn on flashlight</p><p>3. Shine into coin while holding coin at 45 degrees to light source.</p><p>4. Analyze results</p><p><br /></p><p>Dipped coin:</p><p><img src="https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/2OQOZduDi5bglsdzk23XELcXyzA3NQHgyvqNg4dcyXboncuolrf1ISTx_f_sm_TF6EpSlqCmVVcE0bb2PNUfg4bChDtcSEaECsp44jSHpFhtDBPT63r1-gpSQIalhdt1x0tnZgfz6LuT6jIfyRAwKCuK4HyhThk0ocTbnzAg9FmAIDiROWnqOAXmW4oQH5nRRkUhw5JIJ9ETJZ2oOulkfP9j6HKMVSkziMKegHZyWgOr2Z4nRy864vUw45MZB1W1j6LGYxps2nEPiOkhaZB-3PNQKEFQrHPtWyruAY9wPZEKbNrzOJxVB2qXzfaaAmcVFxWHRvIOuzJ9ka-vpy5iZ0-7jwLJ9fl0S32CPHSwHQCfL8dqgSV8NiKveEtQopZ1Qk3OGN2jGZnVTQGIvu0LhausFTR92fqubxawHCWoNOA6BcMDCLk6beO5t7qbO9JFJ1rJp9OqEnn2qfVCg5r8gElRKLiUDsryeRmIotasPxBB1hTXA6US96Cj91p2JSpSk1_iMsWs87qCQLTCAXenLg15ZjzZ2JNwfqYwZDpWKPnoqmkQ6qCdecpuheuSemcUl-lC_zw0k0jwu-7oToPPaU_wKAliFj6bH9t9N8pGP4ahyLeahp0BS33bobWhDEcmcGRF2t4GK-Qdg2PyMn31iMROqe6Lqgc=w1205-h904-no" class="bbCodeImage wysiwygImage" alt="" unselectable="on" /></p><p><img src="https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/ySXpxRZkSikhv47r8xWB5A6MSRUsYriB6O3JbhQIw2wzGQoBTb2a5MFwRtNkS8CIoCIJVNB1Oi4iKY3WhGaNRKvKMwtrK7c1bRta3LEForf_kY6BPkrmIW4k-gsZCVrQuvtitTfAzyAjS-N58C8MhC1aOGGSj4WHvyYO94Ua2fsqMEefLzZ0JBlfp6Y8PpCe0dg9d1t0Kq90jXkmw4zEZw9QiNS5vPSW9ssX2Ta5WBphBEh1t74QRdbwQ6cV4jfB3fNUceqkz3h7y0_15oDuzQbMJ9z9CEBefTa0jvc_6_nSA0V-eQmsLUjj7Y4-ud_RVyP1UWUKt-lB4BuXxgeDpaccSOblKAqlIXxNZF_-XDCnPPsAsyMcXaa3aK9O8arNLgYtF47f71LGKL6oensXvX6dHhFOdz2bJ0oS-CE0cCzR2IThn8H-8JgMMT-drHCcoSBqmBKC0ZknnuX2OAnNI2rXxCMAsLRgkp-bk1hKh0VArHWcsC9zjLJfjbfcZhYmEFJ6hcbNelIf73K-uWHvsgP3E5GOAG8Rn53EpjLnHTgalch-1bFp-EQU4mLPbGVf9A9D_fn_2VMttlWZmqsqMvr1aEXbSgTFZ5e2o5QM5-hPyQvhkXrYvARsarafT1e7tFEVGg1eGQ6wgRe_zoIGpksk_kONQ58=w959-h719-no" class="bbCodeImage wysiwygImage" alt="" unselectable="on" /></p><p><br /></p><p>Near PL coin</p><p><img src="https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/cSjOjmVOPj_fRbS9BFFbL8uFqLXEyrQyI_V5_joIDmDMKef8QOGOgWwulCZsCymEW5IeRrcLPAHmsmo-ntYP5wjg9JnK1yze1a7jMWYbHonc63-iL1Xt1mOdrb9bkFIA8MdpyyWfUqOy3oisIDDasWJG18vPIsUZc-ZikH7kY_vTBO-i26dOLzaF2nezgCOF_0zIyB0ufYsK2bSmkB29nh6z3gQPbsRgwv0jKEYgjNpL0FzMCtPkcxB5v2PBDcPNHc9Xpehch-aKy1dJzyH0qK48OS7fHyZ6vzSEHLffHLds955dg-Gppu9ll0r7bJH_azFUAFcCBK_HX1f2fdr5K3zKgy3-pkYKq1210W3VxWm51BadzDC22gD-3hSazZ4mDcdMmh5HmnLhg4wF6bLgH_BOwlk0arv3vyjbv9u7z8buKBRiZoO_K29G9-HzxvyDvCjekCBhCswD-gk6ykCz1fXM6QBO4GBUzO3_F4ngHXM3zuL75EdTq-6EBX6hD9bZchnf31AmcQfgM4B3nkPCuW5pNGeySsjo7YPyaGfXZOUmyxp-okZq8Q83xsUpFAC41SfMu_5_O9Bl9hzosNGUXzjh9KDoZC24ePrtjo0ODTQzSgMqNbJs6xRseh0sx1jqBw8roLF4gUWGaWQSGr3V0gvPnfafX4s=w959-h719-no" class="bbCodeImage wysiwygImage" alt="" unselectable="on" /></p><p><img src="https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/alVyB0rPXdON0ixWYNxtmC7xJOOIfuEi85nwWBd0ADntT2zH_1MOXJWaRETSZFo8WGRj9Mrp73MUGAWU_fPZtjOTl7zRwRUhTqDEb56kZLEn6DGsbrm05oYJtAzprjZ61HlKf7xCLFjLvEPqIkSata3p6f1sm_Rrt5GW25x4XakY5OG6gUtOzqWf5u3jA2lFydrB7oRf7ANmHsS5r0Ax132SiOF3dKw7_0uBD1BuY3LAsmte0Fd55mK-_9nj19t30YAvoC3Z7JQ5KJK9NbNXSXfV3BucMmyXNvyqmLScH7FBL2Wwk399AwcG7F4o0KVDfvLpB1O-PFueHNDVNblD0CwuuBMw2K22vr-EaudELxLMQHl23jgzXUPVficl5PtUAdsAgep0s8v18BqhqhQK-nZ7RMZyZL3Hr8PWsjxwq-MoJfM5bA_OAa6E_a2d62aN8De__jPqBvIRsUYGQHO7x_KrD2yvHkjFIFVrPaQWccEwZfJmzurUB8Nd4YhJs7qQUgkj9GlJ-jT64Ed_j8kvH8dyjLNfSnxl091uFD15rIOkzRdDXnlLIqLnywIueeTNDuLJXHdZI6z4-tZj3uH9womoAvtHKdmFTdhD469A647bOe8mY1vGtZAHbKeu4Hbvnd1_zHRRghfsgapBppC-g6qzLuoNFLE=w959-h719-no" class="bbCodeImage wysiwygImage" alt="" unselectable="on" /></p><p><br /></p><p>Lustrous MS 61</p><p><img src="https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/GciMFuG_HAuFz77JG4Zh9H82FIAXxN2jr8GrpdCsICAd5UeM2INJD7pIHFFt_rndvnNuir-z7HYr1aC1SbUMhvLA4-ryQ7C5K5SX4hDTDiwL2zJcU8RJ8dULqfhApj37tlQ771pkTU_9BJRna-0W1bNhffHwjMhgaVOlOUNYNwTW3CoHKASY5BHkn7GvsgQoD8SjDezU79H1dL0QqqBdePEt4VRNooqBaMFiVh2aTcogaeWI-5jjkLVsEo8jl690gXgQVmNZB1LriUNQlix9aI45x2gqVne5xffKJl9Mi2MTpb9BXNd8XedWxgZeGvEFwceoR2UrX2VIkuuBA5Ho5xJ3EDDaRC-HTdz41NPklczdBIu7L2OcO5xXT5nfDA71Uc0EkNdRSbCxiINZfVy5mj7gRz3RXvzTKmjZQhpI43iG1OJ34wsCauaugn5NnOEgjki0cNFaWix-XeAI1eytUoyw_7jGOH_Xz2ZtAQAO_XUXIG15Ky-arj36ykTsNUHWAAtoFUuxPhNt4H-BS_TkpA6GFP3flGWwzgoH_57AIpqtH_k8Rte4VIiCSZC31X-aFRYfnyJHWWeftK9Y-1j3cMravAYOWKe6C6NPCBFq9Qx16dXKbi6OE9F-jbPpa7UecuVqHjVFJO26A2jFxwEkkPy4NeCyir8=w959-h719-no" class="bbCodeImage wysiwygImage" alt="" unselectable="on" /></p><p><img src="https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/NEZX1dqczQN_q03BigbjR5G0ochHaNTj93eVVONX4QlJ-I8gK86l7a0CFsgeMXF80Pcz5s6rTL2DfalUED2ljm-EV2Ksd8L2ocDWqjFbNTwxWdmkV5KVd0iWknjqzbS2AZgBlHZGD_v92nxBU3VilNPEG97sWQVJ4rhGM-sL7pNd1_cHY5ABWCcCCwEi-8IHsVqUXP42i0jnA7Dr5dYRVVRI5VR7tzmnNvnqumVoLFd6zQpYGS_SKzMqksHub3gJ-wdmfC53lMYgs_LDgjTG0XalLeKag65rHuxNUdaz-VrAvKErXvfWiqKKEQhe80-aHFPi3-onbnCaEVtAH7P2EmmWieYu1S1-gvo8ZW3EO-kwOgJMi6SzcyGfFY-bbFXQHQ3t3IYvR1DiJGQfRWUyOIQituJLaagLq-I5lmI7qHFtfip0ey7zxQa02BeeH_3NBMLtQq0ObrVvBYgtPbZ5-utrxpZS55SqjNqxNDjYi8gw-aQfzqbfDHp9ibZUIUSCX1uiW2OQAmuBemYatwX-mGgi7WK_AD0M2gGB1r1QUOPhC5slOcsEBWPhQ4YdM74pL8XV6QqY9I3F4KszoCOYtApUM4B6qlp-46bWysj8VZiq3wudfsR6TKnEafRa91j4ODLGGi19WcfBT09xVxtZKHvSdw0mdOw=w959-h719-no" class="bbCodeImage wysiwygImage" alt="" unselectable="on" /></p><p><br /></p><p><u><b>RESULTS and INTERPENETRATION </b></u></p><p>1. The dipped coin shows a clear difference in the mirrored surfaces of the fields and the devices. A clear example of very reflective fields on both the obverse and reverse. This coin MAY be PL. (if not dipped)</p><p><br /></p><p>2. The near PL coin shows slightly less reflection in the fields but a clear crisp line between fields and devices. However, comparing the reverse to the dipped reverse you can clearly see reflection is lost. This coin MAY have a PL obverse but not a Pl reverse.</p><p><br /></p><p>3. The very lustrous 99 shows no definition. This coin IS NOT PL.</p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p>Example with a slabbed coin I thought should've been PL.</p><p>[ATTACH=full]920412[/ATTACH]</p><p><img src="https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/utQygQZpxgJUJSVJ0y_VN5xzmg0kD0fDcNKGHxqVVZMENs6U7IDS0s-jbTXuP8NmRuP39qP-i8MVwD1hMPmIn-ZEvsdqzo4W-6V9KGNHgyuljSbChqlDzha5NOe9HPHqcjWu_vNPLP32tlwEJ3_anMl4KL59hR7kmf3e_AyMzJxunqmiQaIarmpwPHSo97rA3cJuWRoQXXa-qtsoy7Fv05PFIWPkmb1mXiwv6u7hDKNQwTyVHE5A5o5CdyjrXou2XTDG2uTfFHFs6EWRoz3jm8GOLOhGXWwc0E15Xwol0TFBxZLL3fhZn8T9FVGC9gOOj-v7xQMjd9k_dEuQaYyKNPB_RJiNvgiFHHzjb0QgOPmVcNCVd8NK4VBvvyu6wprscpbPZmQRVVtHOSib1W1ciTMbThs0ScWHRMJZWst7Kd-5oG2ZkFaQ2H3Bl1jhvS6slBQNLg_Iw3xfLNXlVXcdYpzeehYObcRczATQ5oeVcrLVX7Fw1KoTanAMG4X9cRHkELcakgYR-KaSB54WxCKhqeokaIevb_5IxX-Vwo1YYyBCOtuhD7E3YbR0n2F_WoAX55riBGVKMZl2P3L0Dlhkw4JjY9GwzTHv-EHbPBOOl0PySaQV9eWl0L7gKfTJoLMFPoclrvpxJLH_cgWUZ1wf2Fh01JU-Jmo=w959-h719-no" class="bbCodeImage wysiwygImage" alt="" unselectable="on" /></p><p><img src="https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/69eJE9ZwihTk_BEU0dCd_P00XLzzpg7Kz05kJPmjR89sZuBracquSGxGT041P0XrmyzdUrXePYPesYsnTmg5oYQBouTCeDlH6CGrNsz6yVhARgNW1x98eWMh7agiLYTPV6UT2qZ3qV_KDQVwcYTprFCxYPw4rNZdUpopKRy470l-2dUmwzZfoo6d6WSp8tPwrppcl3JaOX9byrmq9DNDgvV749yB8tpuKhcyr-U_8NAEROu8UompT7J3ZvbZUjG0B1OglsVpTcuYKKa0X8uepVsvEr96pnRA9p-goNra6IX4-QXXVAuEX2hOn1AsyR_gXt7A_DofLQMjVc1M3deszFez3UCMhX5zUCq5Mc9LbjaNW1_fkXyaFeUFSggcUasFivULxNt2l3tb0O-0Qr3uA9XTbxzimUGK5GfCT7dt0tybl9fkhoDpHYIGhL45iIZM80IxqaAQrV21vlnoJ5XXQgse5bjwwVnEu86JvX_4wO3kPXd9TjU9YeGOOdzs9jFjiHkYym1hhDPrEyN1JCrMvMhBiNPDnLKxYAh0TeshDwWyeKBFuiPMO2rxJfwPb9-TDLHNNq_RqQC9qaZJsqza2whvRvP1HEwZfqIN8PsBi7hqgM_VFPgJFnlLX1IjMvS8K1Dt4ONySuCoSxgdouzq1RcmmDl3aPE=w959-h719-no" class="bbCodeImage wysiwygImage" alt="" unselectable="on" /></p><p>Previously I had no clue since I could not use the image reflection test with the coin in the slab. Now I can clearly see the obverse MAY be PL but the reverse IS NOT.</p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p>Thanks for reading, I hope you learned a bit and can use the <i>Lux</i> <i>Reflection Technique </i>is your collecting futures!</p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p>Sourced and Images from wikipedia</p><p><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reflection_(physics)#Reflection_of_light" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reflection_(physics)#Reflection_of_light" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reflection_(physics)#Reflection_of_light</a>[/QUOTE]</p><p><br /></p>
[QUOTE="LuxUnit, post: 3460560, member: 90324"]As a [I]novice [/I]collector, something that I and many others struggle with is identifying a [I]PROOF LIKE[/I] (PL) coin. This simple system I developed is a good starting point for understanding the question "Does my coin have a chance at being PL". This does not answer "Is my coin PL". You can also use this technique with slabbed coins unlike the traditional 4" reflection test. [U]Just to reiterate by using my technique you can come to two conclusions:[/U] 1. My coin [B]MAY BE [/B]PL. 2. My coin [B]IS NOT [/B]PL. That's it! I call it the [I]LUX REFLECTION TECHNIQUE[/I]. Because we will be focusing on [B]light [/B]reflection [U]not[/U] [B]image [/B]reflection like the typical 4" and 8" standards... and Lux is Latin for light! :p [B]FYI[/B]: If you don't care about the science skip ahead to where this comes into play or the set up. [U][B]A Quick understanding of reflections[/B][/U] A little background on reflection and the simple explanation of how it words will help us in determining if a coin MAY be PL. The second Law of reflection states: "The angle which the incident ray makes with the normal is equal to the angle which the reflected ray makes to the same normal." As seen below. [IMG]https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/10/Reflection_angles.svg/800px-Reflection_angles.svg.png[/IMG] (wiki) Simplified it states [I]a ray of light that reflects off of a mirrored surface will reflect off at the same angle that it it originally struck the surface. [/I]This is useful information that most of us already understand even if you don't recognize it. For example, if you took a mirror and stood at a 45 degree angle from it you would see a 45 degree reflection of where the mirror is pointing to like looking around a corner or using a periscope. This will later be applied. The second concept of importance is understanding [I]Diffuse [/I]reflection vs. [I]Specular [/I]reflection. Simply put [B]diffuse reflection[/B] is when light hits a non mirror like surface and gives it light reflection and provides the images we see, such as the sun illuminating a grassy field so we can see it. Exactly why we can not see anything in a pitch black room, without objects diffusely reflecting light our eyes could not pick up their images. [B]Specular reflection[/B] is what you see in mirrors. An exact replication of the light that shined on the surface is reflected back. Exactly like looking in a mirror. By using the information we know about Specular and diffuse reflection we know that if a coin that is more mirror like will give a more specular reflection. And a coin that is less mirror like will give a less defined or diffuse reflection. [B][U]How collectors currently home test PL coins[/U][/B] The above concept is currently how many collectors determine whether their coin is PL or not, the current home test is to see if your coin reflects an image from 4" or 8" distances. But the problem with this test is how clear does a coin have to be in order for the image to be considered reflected (or specular). And if you attempt to reflect through a slab then the plastic enhances the reflection. [B][U]WHERE THIS TECHNIQUE COMES INTO PLAY [/U][/B] Rather than using the idea of image reflection, my technique takes into consideration [B]LIGHT [/B]reflection (yes images are actually light reflections but for arguments sake lets keep reflected [I]images [/I]and reflected [I]light [/I]separate). The concept is a metal surface that is more mirror like will reflect light in a less diffuse pattern and a more specular pattern. In order to view how diffuse/specular a coins light reflection is we will now use the second law of reflection. By Shining a light at a coin and holding that coin at a 45 degree angle to that light source you can reflect the light source another 45 degrees downward so the image is exactly 90 degrees onto your table. This should create an exact image of where the coin reflects light vs where it does not. A perfectly reflective coin should have a specular reflection heavily from the fields but not at the devices giving off a mirror image of the fields with a shadowed area of the devices. Secondly, the old technique is impossible to use when wanting to view reflections of images through slabs. But using my technique the reflection of light off the slab does not matter because the amount of light reflected is even on all surfaces therefore if the slab reflects the light making the fields appear more reflective it will also make the devices appear more reflective. This means the contrast between fields and devices is the same ratio regardless of whether there is slab or not. Essentially, you will see the same amount of definition of the devices whether the slab reflects or not. [U][B]The set up:[/B][/U] 100 lumen LED flashlight (any bright light that isn't too diffuse) A regular piece of computer paper This example uses 3 coins: 1. A dipped mirror like ~63 1882 Morgan 2. A (near) 64 PL 1879 Morgan 3. A ~MS 61 1899 Morgan with heavy luster (If I had a PL coin or DMPL coin this would be easier, I'm sorry I used what I had available) How to position coin and light [IMG]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/n6gQ9aTe8pUN3dAxskHea7g4bAjSvoh8WZvcxgIXr2drP9Rxm2Hb-amSVYGHvswFIESEAxQ8w5u1Nmml-0n2-A5pugtKbWdJa_mtNp57ZhEo8MDUpfIQqto-E-hqMAmkcFW7OcaEYVSFE6zEr8I5I6XvoJC1NOuCajQMHSradZNj9_OESSgWoJsqp6ZYGcIw0kApXP8BCNc8Be6C5-bZA4Kyor4kBpyaufLaE8PnIlFe_VfdUFK15BlZmIf4MIt37zx452ZF5-3UBRi3giuhrYUdLCbS48PZPRvsWEt0CBOuOrR4nJF-PpTQhV_OL0DG0zafqxpQ01etmCRlyCB46bBJSexaMxmzRILgWqwgJWz-_ohTI_x6ulX0vcp-AtxNOYT85nLCqcDghWRe7RI5CAsIbC-06-fu3N_vjtX64zgG_QHyheQvmWilaFDaj8r84q7UMU9NhsxEuCjLG9r9jlOk6yuHygVBHDB55AyA9yIJ0eLWWUaim4L9YL0OMJQejnAWDbYLLptJlubHZ5R6Z1PFTg9ut7a1RVzFc8fRgzB79iacdIKxxzuCkVu5RRZdf_Tu_1bLr6Kx2XfiSVVDMCwZDWDdyPah6kUIKkm3esDgghEq6Dx8axyCUBHJ4qvPK-VhpqRyECwYNzCs-optdOX3E0DE3ak=w1205-h904-no[/IMG] Procedure: 1. Turn off lights 2. Turn on flashlight 3. Shine into coin while holding coin at 45 degrees to light source. 4. Analyze results Dipped coin: [IMG]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/2OQOZduDi5bglsdzk23XELcXyzA3NQHgyvqNg4dcyXboncuolrf1ISTx_f_sm_TF6EpSlqCmVVcE0bb2PNUfg4bChDtcSEaECsp44jSHpFhtDBPT63r1-gpSQIalhdt1x0tnZgfz6LuT6jIfyRAwKCuK4HyhThk0ocTbnzAg9FmAIDiROWnqOAXmW4oQH5nRRkUhw5JIJ9ETJZ2oOulkfP9j6HKMVSkziMKegHZyWgOr2Z4nRy864vUw45MZB1W1j6LGYxps2nEPiOkhaZB-3PNQKEFQrHPtWyruAY9wPZEKbNrzOJxVB2qXzfaaAmcVFxWHRvIOuzJ9ka-vpy5iZ0-7jwLJ9fl0S32CPHSwHQCfL8dqgSV8NiKveEtQopZ1Qk3OGN2jGZnVTQGIvu0LhausFTR92fqubxawHCWoNOA6BcMDCLk6beO5t7qbO9JFJ1rJp9OqEnn2qfVCg5r8gElRKLiUDsryeRmIotasPxBB1hTXA6US96Cj91p2JSpSk1_iMsWs87qCQLTCAXenLg15ZjzZ2JNwfqYwZDpWKPnoqmkQ6qCdecpuheuSemcUl-lC_zw0k0jwu-7oToPPaU_wKAliFj6bH9t9N8pGP4ahyLeahp0BS33bobWhDEcmcGRF2t4GK-Qdg2PyMn31iMROqe6Lqgc=w1205-h904-no[/IMG] [IMG]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/ySXpxRZkSikhv47r8xWB5A6MSRUsYriB6O3JbhQIw2wzGQoBTb2a5MFwRtNkS8CIoCIJVNB1Oi4iKY3WhGaNRKvKMwtrK7c1bRta3LEForf_kY6BPkrmIW4k-gsZCVrQuvtitTfAzyAjS-N58C8MhC1aOGGSj4WHvyYO94Ua2fsqMEefLzZ0JBlfp6Y8PpCe0dg9d1t0Kq90jXkmw4zEZw9QiNS5vPSW9ssX2Ta5WBphBEh1t74QRdbwQ6cV4jfB3fNUceqkz3h7y0_15oDuzQbMJ9z9CEBefTa0jvc_6_nSA0V-eQmsLUjj7Y4-ud_RVyP1UWUKt-lB4BuXxgeDpaccSOblKAqlIXxNZF_-XDCnPPsAsyMcXaa3aK9O8arNLgYtF47f71LGKL6oensXvX6dHhFOdz2bJ0oS-CE0cCzR2IThn8H-8JgMMT-drHCcoSBqmBKC0ZknnuX2OAnNI2rXxCMAsLRgkp-bk1hKh0VArHWcsC9zjLJfjbfcZhYmEFJ6hcbNelIf73K-uWHvsgP3E5GOAG8Rn53EpjLnHTgalch-1bFp-EQU4mLPbGVf9A9D_fn_2VMttlWZmqsqMvr1aEXbSgTFZ5e2o5QM5-hPyQvhkXrYvARsarafT1e7tFEVGg1eGQ6wgRe_zoIGpksk_kONQ58=w959-h719-no[/IMG] Near PL coin [IMG]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/cSjOjmVOPj_fRbS9BFFbL8uFqLXEyrQyI_V5_joIDmDMKef8QOGOgWwulCZsCymEW5IeRrcLPAHmsmo-ntYP5wjg9JnK1yze1a7jMWYbHonc63-iL1Xt1mOdrb9bkFIA8MdpyyWfUqOy3oisIDDasWJG18vPIsUZc-ZikH7kY_vTBO-i26dOLzaF2nezgCOF_0zIyB0ufYsK2bSmkB29nh6z3gQPbsRgwv0jKEYgjNpL0FzMCtPkcxB5v2PBDcPNHc9Xpehch-aKy1dJzyH0qK48OS7fHyZ6vzSEHLffHLds955dg-Gppu9ll0r7bJH_azFUAFcCBK_HX1f2fdr5K3zKgy3-pkYKq1210W3VxWm51BadzDC22gD-3hSazZ4mDcdMmh5HmnLhg4wF6bLgH_BOwlk0arv3vyjbv9u7z8buKBRiZoO_K29G9-HzxvyDvCjekCBhCswD-gk6ykCz1fXM6QBO4GBUzO3_F4ngHXM3zuL75EdTq-6EBX6hD9bZchnf31AmcQfgM4B3nkPCuW5pNGeySsjo7YPyaGfXZOUmyxp-okZq8Q83xsUpFAC41SfMu_5_O9Bl9hzosNGUXzjh9KDoZC24ePrtjo0ODTQzSgMqNbJs6xRseh0sx1jqBw8roLF4gUWGaWQSGr3V0gvPnfafX4s=w959-h719-no[/IMG] [IMG]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/alVyB0rPXdON0ixWYNxtmC7xJOOIfuEi85nwWBd0ADntT2zH_1MOXJWaRETSZFo8WGRj9Mrp73MUGAWU_fPZtjOTl7zRwRUhTqDEb56kZLEn6DGsbrm05oYJtAzprjZ61HlKf7xCLFjLvEPqIkSata3p6f1sm_Rrt5GW25x4XakY5OG6gUtOzqWf5u3jA2lFydrB7oRf7ANmHsS5r0Ax132SiOF3dKw7_0uBD1BuY3LAsmte0Fd55mK-_9nj19t30YAvoC3Z7JQ5KJK9NbNXSXfV3BucMmyXNvyqmLScH7FBL2Wwk399AwcG7F4o0KVDfvLpB1O-PFueHNDVNblD0CwuuBMw2K22vr-EaudELxLMQHl23jgzXUPVficl5PtUAdsAgep0s8v18BqhqhQK-nZ7RMZyZL3Hr8PWsjxwq-MoJfM5bA_OAa6E_a2d62aN8De__jPqBvIRsUYGQHO7x_KrD2yvHkjFIFVrPaQWccEwZfJmzurUB8Nd4YhJs7qQUgkj9GlJ-jT64Ed_j8kvH8dyjLNfSnxl091uFD15rIOkzRdDXnlLIqLnywIueeTNDuLJXHdZI6z4-tZj3uH9womoAvtHKdmFTdhD469A647bOe8mY1vGtZAHbKeu4Hbvnd1_zHRRghfsgapBppC-g6qzLuoNFLE=w959-h719-no[/IMG] Lustrous MS 61 [IMG]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/GciMFuG_HAuFz77JG4Zh9H82FIAXxN2jr8GrpdCsICAd5UeM2INJD7pIHFFt_rndvnNuir-z7HYr1aC1SbUMhvLA4-ryQ7C5K5SX4hDTDiwL2zJcU8RJ8dULqfhApj37tlQ771pkTU_9BJRna-0W1bNhffHwjMhgaVOlOUNYNwTW3CoHKASY5BHkn7GvsgQoD8SjDezU79H1dL0QqqBdePEt4VRNooqBaMFiVh2aTcogaeWI-5jjkLVsEo8jl690gXgQVmNZB1LriUNQlix9aI45x2gqVne5xffKJl9Mi2MTpb9BXNd8XedWxgZeGvEFwceoR2UrX2VIkuuBA5Ho5xJ3EDDaRC-HTdz41NPklczdBIu7L2OcO5xXT5nfDA71Uc0EkNdRSbCxiINZfVy5mj7gRz3RXvzTKmjZQhpI43iG1OJ34wsCauaugn5NnOEgjki0cNFaWix-XeAI1eytUoyw_7jGOH_Xz2ZtAQAO_XUXIG15Ky-arj36ykTsNUHWAAtoFUuxPhNt4H-BS_TkpA6GFP3flGWwzgoH_57AIpqtH_k8Rte4VIiCSZC31X-aFRYfnyJHWWeftK9Y-1j3cMravAYOWKe6C6NPCBFq9Qx16dXKbi6OE9F-jbPpa7UecuVqHjVFJO26A2jFxwEkkPy4NeCyir8=w959-h719-no[/IMG] [IMG]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/NEZX1dqczQN_q03BigbjR5G0ochHaNTj93eVVONX4QlJ-I8gK86l7a0CFsgeMXF80Pcz5s6rTL2DfalUED2ljm-EV2Ksd8L2ocDWqjFbNTwxWdmkV5KVd0iWknjqzbS2AZgBlHZGD_v92nxBU3VilNPEG97sWQVJ4rhGM-sL7pNd1_cHY5ABWCcCCwEi-8IHsVqUXP42i0jnA7Dr5dYRVVRI5VR7tzmnNvnqumVoLFd6zQpYGS_SKzMqksHub3gJ-wdmfC53lMYgs_LDgjTG0XalLeKag65rHuxNUdaz-VrAvKErXvfWiqKKEQhe80-aHFPi3-onbnCaEVtAH7P2EmmWieYu1S1-gvo8ZW3EO-kwOgJMi6SzcyGfFY-bbFXQHQ3t3IYvR1DiJGQfRWUyOIQituJLaagLq-I5lmI7qHFtfip0ey7zxQa02BeeH_3NBMLtQq0ObrVvBYgtPbZ5-utrxpZS55SqjNqxNDjYi8gw-aQfzqbfDHp9ibZUIUSCX1uiW2OQAmuBemYatwX-mGgi7WK_AD0M2gGB1r1QUOPhC5slOcsEBWPhQ4YdM74pL8XV6QqY9I3F4KszoCOYtApUM4B6qlp-46bWysj8VZiq3wudfsR6TKnEafRa91j4ODLGGi19WcfBT09xVxtZKHvSdw0mdOw=w959-h719-no[/IMG] [U][B]RESULTS and INTERPENETRATION [/B][/U] 1. The dipped coin shows a clear difference in the mirrored surfaces of the fields and the devices. A clear example of very reflective fields on both the obverse and reverse. This coin MAY be PL. (if not dipped) 2. The near PL coin shows slightly less reflection in the fields but a clear crisp line between fields and devices. However, comparing the reverse to the dipped reverse you can clearly see reflection is lost. This coin MAY have a PL obverse but not a Pl reverse. 3. The very lustrous 99 shows no definition. This coin IS NOT PL. Example with a slabbed coin I thought should've been PL. [ATTACH=full]920412[/ATTACH] [IMG]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/utQygQZpxgJUJSVJ0y_VN5xzmg0kD0fDcNKGHxqVVZMENs6U7IDS0s-jbTXuP8NmRuP39qP-i8MVwD1hMPmIn-ZEvsdqzo4W-6V9KGNHgyuljSbChqlDzha5NOe9HPHqcjWu_vNPLP32tlwEJ3_anMl4KL59hR7kmf3e_AyMzJxunqmiQaIarmpwPHSo97rA3cJuWRoQXXa-qtsoy7Fv05PFIWPkmb1mXiwv6u7hDKNQwTyVHE5A5o5CdyjrXou2XTDG2uTfFHFs6EWRoz3jm8GOLOhGXWwc0E15Xwol0TFBxZLL3fhZn8T9FVGC9gOOj-v7xQMjd9k_dEuQaYyKNPB_RJiNvgiFHHzjb0QgOPmVcNCVd8NK4VBvvyu6wprscpbPZmQRVVtHOSib1W1ciTMbThs0ScWHRMJZWst7Kd-5oG2ZkFaQ2H3Bl1jhvS6slBQNLg_Iw3xfLNXlVXcdYpzeehYObcRczATQ5oeVcrLVX7Fw1KoTanAMG4X9cRHkELcakgYR-KaSB54WxCKhqeokaIevb_5IxX-Vwo1YYyBCOtuhD7E3YbR0n2F_WoAX55riBGVKMZl2P3L0Dlhkw4JjY9GwzTHv-EHbPBOOl0PySaQV9eWl0L7gKfTJoLMFPoclrvpxJLH_cgWUZ1wf2Fh01JU-Jmo=w959-h719-no[/IMG] [IMG]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/69eJE9ZwihTk_BEU0dCd_P00XLzzpg7Kz05kJPmjR89sZuBracquSGxGT041P0XrmyzdUrXePYPesYsnTmg5oYQBouTCeDlH6CGrNsz6yVhARgNW1x98eWMh7agiLYTPV6UT2qZ3qV_KDQVwcYTprFCxYPw4rNZdUpopKRy470l-2dUmwzZfoo6d6WSp8tPwrppcl3JaOX9byrmq9DNDgvV749yB8tpuKhcyr-U_8NAEROu8UompT7J3ZvbZUjG0B1OglsVpTcuYKKa0X8uepVsvEr96pnRA9p-goNra6IX4-QXXVAuEX2hOn1AsyR_gXt7A_DofLQMjVc1M3deszFez3UCMhX5zUCq5Mc9LbjaNW1_fkXyaFeUFSggcUasFivULxNt2l3tb0O-0Qr3uA9XTbxzimUGK5GfCT7dt0tybl9fkhoDpHYIGhL45iIZM80IxqaAQrV21vlnoJ5XXQgse5bjwwVnEu86JvX_4wO3kPXd9TjU9YeGOOdzs9jFjiHkYym1hhDPrEyN1JCrMvMhBiNPDnLKxYAh0TeshDwWyeKBFuiPMO2rxJfwPb9-TDLHNNq_RqQC9qaZJsqza2whvRvP1HEwZfqIN8PsBi7hqgM_VFPgJFnlLX1IjMvS8K1Dt4ONySuCoSxgdouzq1RcmmDl3aPE=w959-h719-no[/IMG] Previously I had no clue since I could not use the image reflection test with the coin in the slab. Now I can clearly see the obverse MAY be PL but the reverse IS NOT. Thanks for reading, I hope you learned a bit and can use the [I]Lux[/I] [I]Reflection Technique [/I]is your collecting futures! Sourced and Images from wikipedia [url]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reflection_(physics)#Reflection_of_light[/url][/QUOTE]
Your name or email address:
Do you already have an account?
No, create an account now.
Yes, my password is:
Forgot your password?
Stay logged in
Coin Talk
Home
Forums
>
Coin Forums
>
Coin Chat
>
A Beginners Guide to Identifying Proof Like Coins: A new technique
>
Home
Home
Quick Links
Search Forums
Recent Activity
Recent Posts
Forums
Forums
Quick Links
Search Forums
Recent Posts
Competitions
Competitions
Quick Links
Competition Index
Rules, Terms & Conditions
Gallery
Gallery
Quick Links
Search Media
New Media
Showcase
Showcase
Quick Links
Search Items
Most Active Members
New Items
Directory
Directory
Quick Links
Directory Home
New Listings
Members
Members
Quick Links
Notable Members
Current Visitors
Recent Activity
New Profile Posts
Sponsors
Menu
Search
Search titles only
Posted by Member:
Separate names with a comma.
Newer Than:
Search this thread only
Search this forum only
Display results as threads
Useful Searches
Recent Posts
More...
