Featured A 1799 Bust Dollar - An Example of How Grading Standards Change

I first saw this 1799 dollar in 1979. I had just joined a local club in the Boston area, and an older gentleman brought it to a meeting. I told him that if he ever wanted to sell it, that I would be interested.

About ten years later he approached me. He wanted AU money, but I told him that it was really an EF-45. We agreed to let ANACS determine the price. This was in the days when the ANA owned the company and the coins were slabbed in the little white holders.

The coin came back from ANACS in an EF-45 holder. I purchased the piece for strong EF money.

Jump ahead 12 years. I decided to get my collection graded. I cracked this piece out of the ANACS holder and set it to NGC via a dealer with whom I had done a lot of business as a dealer. The coin came back as an NCG AU-55. Here are photos of the piece.



The piece has a quite a bit of luster, and is easily an AU-55 by today's standards.

You can condemn me if you like, but one does have to look at the current market when you are buying coins. You should not and really can't pay tomorrow's price today. Thirty years ago this was an EF-45 according to ANACS. By this time PCGS and NGC had over taken them as the top services.

We can discuss this if you like.

 

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"Easily a 55 by today's standards"? I won't argue, not my series at all. But I still would think 55 is too high. JMHO.

 

BTW I love this issue - it's beautiful in any grade. However, If that's a 55 then mine should be an XF45, no? Currently graded 35 w CAC (NGC). I don't know. the 55 Looks over graded to me, details like the eyes, ribbon and eagles head don't seem to be four grade steps higher than my 35. Could it be that more information about the quality of the original strike has influenced the grading of this issue (that would not be a bad thing)? Would mine grade higher today?

 

Agree with AU, but lower AU than 55.
However the price jump between XF and AU is awesome. Beautiful coin.

 

I believe you would find a regrade of your coin would command a 40, but that is basically what the green bean may be stating. The OP coin is currently a 55.

It's believed Obverse wear should be determined at hair above forehead, shoulder, and bust line. Reverse wear on clouds and breast feathers primarily.

JMHO

 

Looks more like 53 to me, but point taken and still not a 45 today.

 

So it was graded AU55 in 2001? What do you think it would grade today? I don't know that I'd say AU55, but I'd probably say AU. Lots of strike variation on these, so grading by luster rather than details is the way to go. It'll be hard to determine if it was graded over-conservatively back in 1989. You can't really compare with existing 1989-era PCGS or NGC holders effectively, since the upgrades have already mostly been cracked out, and you'll see a bias toward the dogs.

 

I would have graded this AU-50 on a bad day and AU-53 on a good day. A little too much wear on the high points on both sides to be a 55.

 

Is it just me or have I seen a lot of leniency on grading when it comes to early U.S issues in the past 20 years? I have an 1898 that I would grade and sell at Fine (if I was selling) but feel it would fall in a low Very Fine at today's grading standards. The difference in prices would be from a low of $1,450 to $2,400 which is quite a jump between grades. When looking at current Ebay pricing many similar coins seem to be offered at around $1,800? Buying or selling these older issues seems to be more on what you can get than what it is really worth?
I have always been very conservative when grading, especially my own coins, and I see the other side of the issue when folks come in with coins they have way over graded thinking that's all it takes to get that difference in prices. I try to explain that grading is very subjective and the only way to be sure is to send it in and let the 3rd party pros grade and authenticate their coins. If they can trust them then I will trust them! Very few agree to send in coins for grading.

 

With the provided images as my only reference, I’d have to say that I really like that coin as an XF-45. I just don’t see any luster on the obverse and the amount of wear looks about right for the XF-45 grade.

 

I like that coin as an au 50 I see too much luster for a 45 and too much wear for a 55.

 

I'd be surprise if that would sticker or even cross at that grade based off the pictures. Pictures are always difficult to grade from as many issues can be hidden and luster can look many different ways, but if the pictures are accurate I do not see a PCGS 55 and am not convinced it would even be a PCGS AU

 

EX, .. AU .. whatever degree is granted, is a superb piece that adorns any collection. Congrats!

 

The level of luster is consistent with EF-45/AU-50 by today’s overall standards. But bust dollars are given leniency, so this one falls into today’s AU-55 standards for bust dollars. If it was, say, and 1858 O seated half, it would not grade above AU-50.

This one is funny because it simply has too much wear to really be 3 points below a proper AU-58.

 

We all know that grading by individuals is generally greater than the published technical, TPG standards when observing as a potential buyer, and lower when selling. The coin is graded AU-55 by one of the 2 TPG touted by the collecting community to be the supreme grading authority. A current study of published illustrated standards, and "comps" items to be sold on the internet, believedly support the Grade.

This is just another objective proof of questionable grading standards by the touted prominent TPG, as I've shown numerous times by comps and personal regrettable submissions.

There's a reason why my state implemented legislation requiring bonding, refunding of payment for questionable selling practices. This has partially avoided expensive subjective actions as is believed to be seen in the PCI litigation. Personally, as an appreciable buyer, my Numismatic purchases are received out of state.

JMHO

 

Especially This?: https://www.ebay.com/itm/1799-1-BUS...104510?hash=item23ade1b07e:g:GugAAOSwa6Zbsn7v

JMHO

 

I like it at any grade. Pretty coin.

 

Like these did?

https://www.apmex.com/product/152785/1799-draped-bust-dollar-au-55-pcgs

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1799-Draped-Bust-Dollar-NGC-AU-55-B-13-R-5-RARE-/372569783255

 

I’m in agreement. My personal grade is 50 and I think it’d cac green at that. But the tpgs are very lienient on bust dollars especially as so many have problems especially cleanings or rim problems and they’re such a popular series

 

Hard to get an idea of luster on the pcgs one but I see a 55 due to wear. The ngc I’d grade 53