1994 or 1990

Foundinrolls, please post the previous sections where this issue has been discussed. I'd like to read it and hopefully see some examples of what you are associating this with. Thanks. Tom

 

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1994

I think that the four fell under the mintmark when the die hit, that is why the 4 in the 1994 is so messed up looking...kinda looks like and 0 or something. The poor little four, fell to the floor, rolled out the door, and came back for more....lol Sending coin off tomorrow to CONECA. Mr. Potter did write me back, but could not tell from any photo, he will need to see it in hand as suggested before. Thanks everyone for your input!:smile

 

Up toward the top of the forum, in the bar, there is a SEARCH feature. Search in the error forum for zinc rot

Read the posts and look at the pictures in the posts where some are available.

 

Sorry for coming into this late in the subject but here's one way jou can tell what year it is. The reverse " A MERICA" for a 1990 looks like this. For a 1994 it looks like this"AM ERICA". Also check the initials "FG" look like this for a 1990. Whereas for a 1994 the initial gee does not have the horizontal hook on the vertical leg. My avatar is what the 1990 would look like.

 

okay. Thanks Bob

 

I saw nothing in those posts which resemble anything like this. Do you have a specific thread?

 

1994 d

Here is the reverse of my 1994 D penny:smile

 

1994 d/4?

Finally got it off in the mail to CONECA today... how long is the turn around usually? I understand it takes anywhere from 90 to 120 days.

 

1994 d

foundinrolls: help me understand this....I am trying to learn...


Thanks, Michelle

From what I have read, the dies used for the 1994 D Lincoln penny were made in Philly, and there were over 9000 of them. Are you referring to the single-squeeze hubbing process that The Mint announced, in 1999, that all dies were then using them to produce the coins? Denver started using that technology in 1996. What is after 1990? Was the date and mintmark placed on the die together to make it a single process? What is the single-sqeeze hubbing process?

 

Prior to 1990, mint marks were added to individual dies by hand. For 1990 and later coins, in order to make the mint mark more consistent, the D was added to the design right from the beginning phases so that the mint marks were on each hub used to create each die. So from 1990 on, no more repunched mint marks.

Single squeeze technology has to do with the making of dies. There is evidence of single squeeze technology being experimented with as far back as the 1980s.

On cents though, it was around 1996-1997 that that technology became, more or less the standard. Using that date of 1996-1997 for cents as a reference point, single squeeze means that when a die is made, the hub in a "hubbing press" was squeezed into the blank die steel only once to transfer the raised (in relief) details from the hub and create an incuse (recessed) detailed die.

Prior to single squeeze technology, the hub was impressed into the die steel numerous times to bring up the details.

There are for example, Quadrupled and Quintupled dies on some Kennedy halves that prove at least four or five impressions of a hub into the die steel.

In older days, it may have taken ten or more impressions of a hub into the die steel as was the case with some Morgan Dollars, for example.

So "single squeeze" = one impression of the hub into the die blank to create a die.

I hope that's not too fuzzy

Thanks,
Bill

 

After some reading, and what you have said I think I have a pretty good grasp on it now...what happens to the dies after the single sqeeze impression? Are they used again? Or do they get dumped. If 9000 dies were used for the 1994 D penny, with this technology;possibly, then does that mean when they are worn down, they are not refurbished? And if all the dies used in 1994 were made in Philly, couldn't something have happened to the dies or die in transit? Like, say,..a bump in the road?

 

It's possible for a die to be damaged in transit from Philly to Denver , let's say. but the odds are highly against it The dies are securely packaged before shipping.

Before a die is used, it is examined, sometimes not too carefully but it is checked over to a degree

As the dies are being used, if a catastrophic failure occurs, let's say a die just shatters...a press would be stopped and the die would be changed out.

If a press runs out of planchets and there are some die clashes that don't destroy the die but only mark it up some, a choice is made if it is noticed. If the damage done is too severe, the die will be replaced. If the die can be abraded to remove clash marks and then re-used, that will be done. If a die is only lightly marked up, it will continue in service as lighter die clash marks would be eliminated during its use as coins were being struck.

Now...t sounds like there is still a little confusion about something. The "Single Squeeze" is how a die is made to be used in the minting process, so I am not sure why you asked if the dies are used or dumped after the single squeeze...

Thanks,
Bill

 

Pre-1990...you hear a lot about dies being used over and over again...filling with grease and such. I have a penny that has no date, or mintmark. smooth finish. grease filled die? The dies broke more. I was wondering, did they continue business as usual, or have the dies also become stronger and more advanced with the technology?If there were no chance of an error through this system of minting, and creating of dies... then they must discard the dies when unusable.

 

When a die is not useable, they do retire it. They also deface the die.

A grease filled die is not fatal to the die They clean it up and continue to use it.

They try to get as much as they can out of a die before they voluntarily retire it. If you look at nickels from the early eighties or quarters from the early nineties, for example, you will see evidence of dies being used well beyond when they should have been retired.

There are a lot of variables involved.

I know that you might want to suggest that some things like the 1994 D cent can be attributed to a bad die being used. One of the problems with moving in that direction is that the other parts of the coin don't show much, if any evidence of die deterioration.

Die deterioration is a process that is seen as a progression as a die is used.

Anyway....The rest of your questions have to do with dies breaking. I am not sure what the rate of breakage is today versus what it would be on other post 1990 cents, for example.

I do know that they improve the die steel as they improve the hubbing and die making technologies. If you look at coins of the late fifties and early sixties, you will see evidence of die chips more often than you do on coins minted more recently.

During the beginning of the 1980s, particularly on cents you start to see a lot of die breakage evidenced by small die cracks often from the corners of the Memorial building out to the rim. (Die cracks effect other coins as well)

As you get into the 1990s, particularly 1995 and later, you see a lot of die crack evidence on half dollars, particularly along the bottom of Kennedy's bust and sometimes leading from the point of the neck to the rim.

States quarters have evidence of die cracks often seen as a fine line along the bottom of Washington's neck, also leading out toward the edge from the point of the neck.

The designs of the coins and the depths to which the designs are impressed into the dies have as much to do with dies cracking as the die steel itself.

Minor die cracks are the norm and unless the die crack really becomes a problem, coins will be struck by dies that have cracks in them.

I hope that helps.

Bill

 

"I hope that helps"
Well it certainly helped me. Thanks Bill.

 

Bill I appreciate your expertise in the minting process. Thanks a bunch. Tom

 

1994 d

It certainly does help me understand better!!! Thanks again for taking the time to explain how it works. :high5:

 

I'm all for education. There are some folks on these forums that have learned a phenomenal amount over the last year, year and a half, two years or so.

I read through many threads now that I don't even comment on. The folks here have gotten to where it is obvious that they picked up a lot of information and are using it well

I taught music for awhile and I taught different sciences in the past (mostly as a private, freelance teacher) It may sound a little odd, but I did the Jack Hannah and Jeff Corwin type thing for about ten years in PA.

One of my favorite stories has to do with giving several classes at a wildlife sanctuary to a bunch of third graders. Fast forward ten years ...and I see a face walking through the Lehigh Valley Mall in the Allentown, PA area. (The face was attached to legs and a body)...Anyway....This 18 year old kid and I locked eyes and I recognized who he was. He recognized me first and walked over toward me.

He was one of the kids in my class from ten years prior. This now young man who was once considered an "underpriviledged child" starts telling me things that I had taught him ten years before. He fully remembered things that I had taught about fungus on rotted logs He reminded me of things we had studied pertaining to ways to determine the quality of streams in eastern PA.

Anyway...he learned. He also told me that because of the classes we had that he was in college studying to become a research biologist

Why did I march off in that direction?..You might be thinking

The point is that learning and education in any area of life can lead to many unknown things.

One young man that used to write letters to me with coin questions and to tell me about roll finds, (pre email days), is now an up and coming coin dealer in Michigan.

Who knows . Maybe someone here will be the next big error and die variety dealer to emerge in our century

I'm happy to be a small part of that.

But...you gotta learn it right

Have Fun,
Bill

 

1994 d

Learning is what it is all about...you can never know too much! It sounds like you have gotten as much joy out of teaching as others have from being taught by you...I don't know if I would have remembered the fungus on the log stuff...lol, but I was more into cross country running and journalism. I thought about teaching at one time, but never went back to school for it. Who knows, maybe I will....just in time for my daughter to enter kindergarten. She is 2 now, if I start now, .....I could have a BA in education....Dream, Imagine, Believe......still waiting for the results....:hail:

 

1994

Bill,

I came across this statement....

Since 1994, some Lincoln Memorial Cents in high grades show traces of a removed mintmark on the coin. The cause is believed to be the removal of D and S mintmarks from dies or hubs which were originally intended to be sent to the branch mints, but which ended up being used at Philadelphia. They are worth a small premium over normal coins for that date.

What would one of these coins look like, I can't find one...if they were used in Philly, then they didn't have to travel to far...being that all the dies for that year were made there, right?