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<p>[QUOTE=&quot;Insider, post: 2828640, member: 24314&quot;]This is a question I have for the actual gentlemen posting here.&nbsp; Why would someone <img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie47" alt=":greedy:" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" /><img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie30" alt=":bucktooth:" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" /> &quot;tell the world&quot; that he is unethical, has low morals, and is perhaps, one step above a common thief?&nbsp; <img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie46" alt=":facepalm:" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" /></p><p><br /></p><p>TheMont, posted: &quot;Beings the tread talks about counterfeits, I got this back this week from NGC. The members of my Coin Club talked me into submitting both double dies for certification:</p><p>[ATTACH=full]665808[/ATTACH] [ATTACH=full]665810[/ATTACH][/QUOTE]</p><p><br /></p><p>In spite of the fact that you have started an interesting discussion (Beings the tread talks about counterfeits), you&#039;ve <b>hijacked</b> another very interesting discussion.&nbsp; What is the chance that you could put everything you&#039;ve posted into a new discussion &quot;Counterfeit &amp; Genuine 1955 Doubled Dies.&nbsp; I think lots of folks who will not see it here will be interested and perhaps we&#039;ll learn more new things about these coins.</p><p>BTW, that video is very basic and deals with two very high grade coins.&nbsp; Much of the issues in the video go-out-the-window when the coin becomes circulated. <img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie3" alt=":(" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" /></p><p><br /></p><p>Kirkuleez, posted:&nbsp; &quot;Are they easy to detect because the edge leading down to the surface of the coin would show concentric horizontal circles instead of standard fine vertical lines?&nbsp; Do you have any images of this technique...mainly those that you&#039;d consider deceptive?</p><p><br /></p><p>I&#039;ll look for some images (surprised none posted yet) but as I said they are easy to spot as milling one side of the coin so it fits leaves a tell-tale seam, even on the best made examples.&nbsp; The modern alterations are better than those made in the past.&nbsp; There are no concentric circles on the surface as the lathe removes metal right up to the lip of the rim.&nbsp; Then the other machined half is placed into it.&nbsp; Coins without the denticals (Kennedy 50c) are the easiest ones to hide the alteration.</p><p><br /></p><p>If you look up &quot;Magician&#039;s coin,&quot; you&#039;ll see the two halves but not the seam.&nbsp; I&#039;ll post the seam image.</p><p><br /></p><p>PS&nbsp; [USER=3926]@justafarmer[/USER] Since another coin type has been introduced into the thread I have no idea which you are writing about here: &quot;I have a theory that all die pairings have a set established die rotation - which I believe might prove to be one of the more difficult characteristics for a counterfeiter to duplicate.&quot;</p><p><br /></p><p>If it is a general theory for all coins?&nbsp; Then yes, many coins from the same die pair are rotated.&nbsp; Often it becomes a slow progression of increasing degrees.</p><p><br /></p><p>Possibly [USER=74818]@britannia40[/USER] and other members can add to this concerning all the foreign coins they have seen that are rotated.</p><p><br /></p><p>[USER=80121]@TheMont[/USER] posted:&nbsp; Thank you for the YouTube on counterfeit &#039;55s. The one point that stuck out to me was when he said the &quot;L&quot; of Liberty would be up against the rim on a counterfeit, the &quot;L&quot; on my coin is up against the rim. So maybe that is a die indicator that NGC used.</p><p><br /></p><p>The easy-to-see diagnostic on the counterfeit in the video is the raised &quot;hook&quot; on the top of the five.&nbsp; This is an old counterfeit from the early 1980&#039;s.[/QUOTE]</p><p><br /></p>

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