1886 Seated Half NGC MS64+

Which is why, in this case, we left a member feeling a bit double teamed. It is because holding all three titles does have something to do with it and why you stepped aside. I understand and respect the approach, but, it did have something to do with a CT member feeling ganged up on by what he perceived to be mods. I did notice that you stepped aside and I passed that information on, when the CT member reached out to me in private.

 

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Thank you. Your presence as an authority figure in this discussion has been noted.

LostDutchman, my comments here were just an attempt to sympathize with your tough position in this thread. No disrespect intended, but, it's hard when outside factors are skewing my posts and responding to them as if I was 3 years old. Sorry.

When a friend on the forum reached out to me in private, I did my best to diffuse the situation I was presented with. At no point did I try to throw more flames into this topic.

 

Now that everything seems to be settling down I will photograph one of the coins that I bought from Matt last year. And invite everyone else to do the same. Over the past near decade I have bought from and sold to Matt many times over. It is like having an insider with a brick and mortar coin shop that you can trust.

 

I am now the fine owner of this beautiful coin. Matt was easy to work with and I'm excited about adding this coin to my collection. I'll even see about getting her shoulder replacement surgery!

Please see Post #1 for pictures...lol.

 

He sold a proof of the 1880 years ago and I have teased him ever since about it. He wants it back. My collection is rather like the roach motel, they check in, not out!

 

I still miss that coin....

 

You still get to look at it until Tuesday! LOL.

 

Dude you need a few more titles under your avatar. It should stretch at least down a quarter page.

 

They keep popping up... LOL! It seems like every other day lately there is a new one. I blame Peter.

 

You bought that beauty!! Man I was tempted!! congratulations!! If I wasn't trying to stay focused on trades! Was the sexiest coin I've seen for sale lately I'm glad it's got a good home!

 

congrats on the purchase, jpcienkus. That is a sweet coin!

 

Thanks Bill and Ksparrow. I couldn't let that one pass me by.

 

I will agree that as a collector, selling coins is equally important to the general health of this hobby for the individual. There is a wealth of information and experience that you garner from regularly trying to sell your coins from the collector seat.

-Being able to see the 'true' value of your coins and adjusting your buying habits to make better buys if you are consistently selling your coins below what you paid.

-How to dispose of your coins when you are ready to liquidate

-Who to leave as a trusted contact when you pass so that your heirs can receive maximum value for your collection and deal with an upstanding dealer (so we would hope)

-Helps to understand the mindset of the dealer and helps you learn both sides of the buying/selling relationship.

-etc, this list can go on and on and on describing the benefits of selling from time to time as a collector.

Now onto the first part of your response. I just simply cannot believe that as a dealer Matt's only concern is what he should buy this coin for because he was the buyer for a brief moment during his day. He HAS to operate with selling in mind because that is his livelihood and business.

Your example would make sense in a perfect world where a knowledgeable seller meets a knowledgeable buyer and vice versa. That is NOT real life. Not even close.

There are a million + 1 factors that come into play just based off of the PERSON you are dealing with before the many factors of the coin come into consideration. Now many of those factors are dealt with instantaneously, but they are there, in every single transaction, every single time.

Those little 'factors' that I speak of have to do with things like personality, assertiveness, knowledge, leverage, perceived value, etc. I am talking about all of those little thoughts and scenarios that fire back and forth, unspoken most of the time, but picked up by the body language and the little hints in the verbal communication.

What I mean by that is you may have a person that walks into Matt's shop who is aggressive with how he values that coin and is bound and determined to squeeze Matt for as much money as he can get out of him, regardless of what he originally paid for the coin. This would be a knowledgeable, assertive, and aggressive collector.

Or another scenario is that the collector who brought it in paid say $1,000 for it 10 years ago and is satisfied with just adding a $250 profit for himself on it (+ 25% like you suggested was so easy). Maybe this collector wasnt so knowledgeable on this series, and is just passive in how he sells his coins.

The two examples I just mentioned are how vastly different two collector-sellers can be, as everyone is different. So how does Matt approach my first example versus my second one? And this is where he has to be seller-centric minded. The second example I left is easy, the seller clearly had an undervalued, but fair price in mind, Matt pays him, adds his mark-up and KNOWS he has a buyer because he bought well below retail.

Now that other guy I mentioned first was the tricky one, and why Matt would have to think about selling as he is coming up with a value for this coin. he obviously cant pay top of retail, which is hard to determine anyway with this particular coin, and he HAS to be able to buy this coin with the intentions of reselling it. He has to be confident that the price was such that he will have buyers wanting this coin once it is his. This leads me back to the original question of what exactly is the value of this coin?

All those contributing factors of the coin now come into play. The grade on the slab, the eye appeal, the toning, the strike, etc, etc, and while I readily agree that studying coins constantly will yield results in learning this type of stuff, I simply made an observation about a series I enjoy (and relates closely to my main collecting set) and just wanted to understand further how someone like Matt came to his price in a decisive manner. He posted the coin a couple of days ago, I dont have time to study 600 examples of this coin in hand before I post to ask a question, that is the whole point of this forum, so some of us can learn a few things without having to spend hours holding coins to learn every single little thing about them. This forum exists to ask questions and to better understand the things we want to know so that we can grow in our experiences. I wanted to know more about the valuation of this particular coin, i thought the surrounding factors were not unique necessarily, but alot of different things were going on with this coin that made it difficult for me to put a price on it.

I am just going to throw this out there and I do not mean it as any disrespect, but one might draw the conclusion that Matt may not have had enough knowledge as required. What I mean by that is Matt had this coin for less than what, 4 days? And now its gone. Maybe HE had it too cheap, surely he made his money, but how much did he leave on the table? Thats what i am getting at, how to avoid costing myself money in the future, without necessarily having to fondle 15,000 coins to be considered knowledgeable enough to know everything about the market.

***Matt just so you know, I have full faith in your ability to price coins, I am just saying that someone else could draw that conclusion that I mentioned above and I believe it relates to my issues of finding the fair value to not leave money on the table but to sell this coin in a timely fashion. I also know you like quick turnovers and it doenst get much better than how quick this one came and went. All around good job on your part and thanks for your help in contributing to this thread and keeping things on the up and up as far as rules go. We all know this was a sensitive subject and I was just truly wanting to stimulate some thinking and learning and discussion on a wonderful coin you acquired.

Please keep them coming.

 

I wish every coin I bought was like this one. One of the first things you learn in this business is that you never have a problem selling nice coins... And this is a really nice coin. I had several people PM me about this coin. As far as pricing a coin like this... It's not easy. This coin has a VERY large price jump from 64 to 65. It was priced somewhere near the middle of those numbers (which were determined by greysheet and looking at comparable coins sold at auction.) The fact that it is an attractive example made it an easy sell.