1853 Quarter A&R - "dirty, stained, scuffed'... but little actual wear?

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by Eduard, Jun 19, 2019.

  1. Eduard

    Eduard Supporter**

    This is the way old-time English dealers used to describe coins that exhibited intense, original, not really appealing toning, but otherwise little circulation wear.

    This example falls into this category, I believe. I see some scuffs and marks but little actual wear.

    What do you guys think?

    1853 Quarter OBVX better size true colour - 1.jpg 1853 Quarter REVX better colour - 1.jpg
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  3. ddoomm1

    ddoomm1 keep on running

    Maybe due to all the recent posts containing counterfeit coins I am seeing things but:

    - the "3" looks a bit funky
    - the robes look soft
    - the mushy details at 7-8 o'clock on the reverse

    .....or, as Eduard explained, scuffed - with little wear.
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  4. Randy Abercrombie

    Randy Abercrombie Supporter! Supporter

    Oh I do love rays and arrows...... I do find that coin appealing. Yes, I am a bit biased because I much like the design.... But I say this one has eye appeal regardless how you may describe it.
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  5. Collecting Nut

    Collecting Nut Borderline Hoarder

    I just picked up this very coin last week. I got mine at melt value and it's so worn the last digit in the date is as smooth as a newborn baby's butt. The only way I knew the date is because this is the only year that this series had arrows at the date and rays around the eagle.

    Yours is a great looking example! Would you be interested in a straight trade? lol
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  6. Seattlite86

    Seattlite86 Outspoken Member

    +1 with rays coins are probably my favorite US Type. I've yet to add one to my collection, but it's on the list. :)
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  7. Mat

    Mat Ancient Coincoholic

    I love the arrows/rays seated coins. Even with the "scruff" that's a great coin, Eduard.
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  8. Conder101

    Conder101 Numismatist

    Odd that it has finned rims on both obv and rev on the same side of the coin, and then with that it has strangely weak denticals at the lower left rev.
  9. -jeffB

    -jeffB Greshams LEO Supporter

    It doesn't yell "fake" at me, but that reverse weakness on the left and the odd obverse denticles worry me. I've never handled a Seated quarter in anything approaching this grade, though, so I don't know whether this is within the normal range of variation for the series.
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  10. Magnus87

    Magnus87 Supporter! Supporter

    Remember that this issue was struck in huge (for the time) quantities, so not every piece turned out to be perfectly detailed. This one is v. slightly off-center, hence the “finned” rims. My own example (bought in Brazil, but that’s a long story), an XF45 I would say, looks very similar except that at some time in the distant past someone probably cleaned it — but so long ago that it has since toned back to how a century-and-a-half year old silver coin should look.
    Eduard: For what it’s worth, I rather like it; don’t think it needs any apologies!
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  11. Eduard

    Eduard Supporter**

    Thanks, guys for the comments.

    The finned rims are interesting. They are still really well defined on this coin - maybe this accounts for the weak strike in the lower reverse?? who knows.

    In-hand the coin looks better, with really nice detail - I have never had any doubts about its authenticity, however I do have an open mind if it turned out to be otherwise.
    The toning, though, specially on the reverse is just 'too original' (not nice).

    I picked this one up at a flea market in Belgium back in 1985....I'd be surprised if I paid more than 3-5 bucks back then. Those were the days...
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  12. buckeye73

    buckeye73 Active Member

    After reading your description and before seeing the photos, I was prepared for a scudzy coin. Eduard, you frequently under sell your coins in your descriptions. This is another example. This coin does not look fake IMHO. What an excellent arrows & rays quarter!
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  13. johnmilton

    johnmilton Well-Known Member

    Here is the piece in my type set, which NGC graded MS-61.

    1853 w arrows Qu O,jpg.jpg 1853 w arrows Qu R.jpg

    I can't condemn the OP coin outright but the fuzzy look, the finning and the weakness at 7k on the reverse concern me. I also just got back from my local B&M store this morning. We were talking about counterfeits and three Seated Liberty Quarter counterfiets that they had been offered recently that were "darn good."

    I wish the hobby did not have to cope with these issues.
  14. kanga

    kanga 60 Year Collector

    Seated Liberty coins with arrows at the date caught my fancy 10-15 years ago.
    I kept plugging away until I completed the set; half dimes through half dollars.
    Some of the coins, particularly the CC's, are low grade but if you check the price guides you can see why.
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  15. Eduard

    Eduard Supporter**

    I agree with Kanga - Seated Liberty Coinage is really interesting. Sure, they tend to
    (actually do!) look all pretty similar, but there is a lot of history there specially if you consider the different mints. I am now focusing on the early issues, and want to complete a set of 'O' and 'S' mint dimes from the 1840's to 1850's. Some Civil War dates would be nice too...:)
  16. green18

    green18 Sweet on Commemorative Coins Supporter

    The only way I'd buy one of these in todays' market is if it was in a tomb (slab). And from a trusted dealer at that..........
  17. Mainebill

    Mainebill Wild Bill

    I’d say original and crusty. Au 53-55 I’d say. I actually like it
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  18. TheFinn

    TheFinn Well-Known Member

    I see a lot of raised pimples on the reverse, which makes my spidy senses tingle.
  19. Conder101

    Conder101 Numismatist

    Usually a finned rim indicates either a die misaligned far enough that the widened gap between the neck of the die and the collar allows the metal to flow into it. A little odd for it to happen to both sides, plus the coin does not look like the dies are offset that much if at all.

    The second cause of a finned rim is excessive coining pressure that forces the metal into that gap between the collar and neck. But excessive pressure does not seem fit with the weak dental in the same area. If the pressure was excessive I would expect the dentals to be strong as well.
  20. I have one in my type collection AU50 details because of minor scratches I got on the cheap always favored the rays coins mine was graded icg to be authentic
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