1828 Quarter - Please grade

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by Eduard, Sep 19, 2007.

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  1. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator


    Precisely - I am not trying to argue at all. I am trying to understand. And more than that, I am tring to help others understand.

    Just imagine, someone who does not know how to grade reads this thread and sees various grades proposed from VF to AU - what are they to think ? But if we discuss our reasoning for our opinions and discuss the standards we use - then we all may be able to understand the grading process a little better.
     
    GDJMSP, Sep 21, 2007
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  3. zaneman

    zaneman Former Moderator

    I feel that the market grade on this coin is about an au-50. In my opinion the detail is consistent with what the TPG's will call a 50. I am going to post pictures of some bust quarters graded au-50. I find that the coin that Eduard posted has crisp dentils, stars, and exhibits most of the wing detail, and in my opinion matches the details nearly identically to the pictures I have posted.
     

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    zaneman, Sep 21, 2007
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  4. zaneman

    zaneman Former Moderator

    T
     

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    zaneman, Sep 21, 2007
    #23 + Quote Reply
  5. zaneman

    zaneman Former Moderator

    Here is one last photo with 2 right by each other.
     

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    zaneman, Sep 21, 2007
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  6. gopher29

    gopher29 Coin Hoarder

    In my opinion, none of those coins look nice enough to earn a grade of "About Uncirculated". Which company graded those?
     
    gopher29, Sep 21, 2007
    #25 + Quote Reply
  7. zaneman

    zaneman Former Moderator

    Anacs and NGC.
     
    zaneman, Sep 21, 2007
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  8. zaneman

    zaneman Former Moderator

    Here is an PCGS 50, and from what I have seen it iis quite a conservative example of a 50 for PCGS.
     

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    zaneman, Sep 21, 2007
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  9. huntsman53

    huntsman53 Supporter**

    zane,

    I think that PCGS, NGC and ANACS were taking in the eye appeal and remaining Mint luster when considering the grades for the coins that you show! I grant you that Eduard's coin is very close to most of these in condition in respect to wear. However, I feel that it lacks the eye appeal and Mint luster to garner an AU-50 grade.

    Also, based on the pictures of the coins that you provided, I believe that if the other coins are in fact AU-50's, then the 1813 Quarter Dollar is undergraded!


    Frank
     
    huntsman53, Sep 22, 2007
    #28 + Quote Reply
  10. gopher29

    gopher29 Coin Hoarder

    Man, I tell you PCGS is getting really generous in its grading of coins. I have a 1803 large cent that my local dealer only considers to be F-12 which I compared to a similiar coin graded VF-25 by PCGS and I actually think my coin looks nicer.
     
    gopher29, Sep 22, 2007
    #29 + Quote Reply
  11. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Zane, perfect examples of what I was talking about. And if you compare the standards used by PCGS to the ANA standards it is rather easy to understand. For example, the PCGS grading guide says -

    AU55/58 coins have slight friction on the cap, face, bust, hair below the ribbon, and most high points on the rest of the hair. On the reverse, the neck, legs, claws, and tops of the wings have slight wear.

    Worn to AU50/53, there is obvious friction on the noted areas with some hair curls and feathers now slightly flat. The cap and cheek, especially on the small size, will also have noticeable friction, with the field showing rub.

    Based on the above description, the coins do seem to meet the grading criteria used by PCGS. But therein lies the difference. The ANA standards say -

    AU50 obverse -
    Traces of wear show on the hair above the eye and over the ear. Drapery clasp is clear and bold.
    reverse -
    Traces of wear show on talons, arrowheads, and edges of wings.
    Surface - Part of the mint luster is still present.

    AU55 obverse -
    Only a trace of wear shows on highest points of hair above the eye.
    reverse -
    A trace of wear shows on talons and arrowheads.
    Surface - Some of the mint luster is still present.


    Once you compare the two sets of standards to each other, things are a lot easier to undertsand. I also think it is quite obvious that if one were to use the ANA standards that none of the coins pictured in this thread would grade anywhere near AU.

    This comparison also shows us that grading is not as subjective as one might be led to believe. It is more a case of which set of standards one chooses to use.
     
    GDJMSP, Sep 22, 2007
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  12. zaneman

    zaneman Former Moderator

    I couldn't agree more with you Doug! I used to frequently get confused when I was initially learning when I compared my ANA grading guide to PCGS graded coins, but slowly learned that it was merely a difference in standards. It's often amazing to me how different grading standards amongst the ANA and various grading companies differ.
     
    zaneman, Sep 22, 2007
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  13. huntsman53

    huntsman53 Supporter**

    Has anyone really checked out what I noted on my first post in this Thread????? I state again, that there appears to be an extra tail (Serif) on the upper tail (or whatever you call it) of the "1" in the Date and something inside the upper portion of the lower loop of the second "8" in the Date! Could this be an unlisted Overdate or does an Overdate Variety already exist for this Date?


    Frank
     
    huntsman53, Sep 23, 2007
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  14. huntsman53

    huntsman53 Supporter**

    Re-Post!


    Since there have been no comments (posts) concerning what I can see on this coin, I though I would Re-Post it to get it back to the top of Forums! Please let me know what you all think!


    Frank
     
    huntsman53, Sep 27, 2007
    #33 + Quote Reply
  15. gopher29

    gopher29 Coin Hoarder

    I think I see what you're referring to. I guess it could be an overdate. I don't know how much, if anything, that adds to the coin's value. I'm not big into error-coins myslef.
     
    gopher29, Sep 27, 2007
    #34 + Quote Reply
  16. huntsman53

    huntsman53 Supporter**


    gopher,

    Thanks for confirming what I see! If it is an Overdate, these errors are significant in adding to value to a coin and especially so an early Date Quarter!



    Frank
     
    huntsman53, Sep 27, 2007
    #35 + Quote Reply
  17. Treashunt

    Treashunt The Other Frank

    Frank:
    I see what you are referring to.
    The references (especially Breen) do not mention an overdate.
    However, it does look like a re-punched date for the 1.
    Within the lower loop of the 8 -- it looks like the start of a die crack.

    There are 4 Browning #'s for this date.
    But, I don't have that reference.
     
    Treashunt, Sep 28, 2007
    #36 + Quote Reply
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