1652 New England threepence is real!

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by KBBPLL, Aug 23, 2024.

  1. KBBPLL

    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

    A thread about this coin went on for 3+ years on another forum. I had given up on it and figured it was either deemed inconclusive or got gobbled up in a private transaction. I happened to look just now and it is being auctioned by Stack's Bowers in November. The only other known example is at the Massachusetts Historical Society. Quite an amazing story.

    Second Known New England Threepence Consigned to Stack’s Bowers Auction
    https://coinweek.com/second-known-new-england-threepence-consigned-to-stacks-bowers-auction/
     
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  3. KBBPLL

    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

  4. Lon Chaney

    Lon Chaney Well-Known Member

    Interesting [possible/probable] history.
     
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  5. green18

    green18 Unknown member Sweet on Commemorative Coins Supporter

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  6. Tall Paul

    Tall Paul Supporter! Supporter

    Isn't this the third known, not the second? 1. Massachusetts Historical Society coin, 2. Yale University coin that was stolen, and 3. the coin being offered by Stack Bowers.
     
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  7. KBBPLL

    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

    I guess I should have said "currently" known. The Yale coin has been missing for 70+ years.

    The connection to John Adams is interesting but tenuous of course. There could also be a connection to John Quincy Adams, who was appointed ambassador to the Netherlands in 1794. The source of the speculation about provenance is the holder the coin was found in. The Quincy family was quite large by 1798, and it's curious that whomever wrote that on the holder did not specify John or John Quincy, despite them both being quite well known by the time the holder was designated. It's also curious that it was "unknown" for 222 years, despite Thomas Hollis actively seeking the NE threepence, and several sales of them in 1838-1844 in England. John and John Quincy both did have an extensive coin collection.
    20200407_20200407_130500a.jpg
     
  8. KBBPLL

    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

    I notice that they "conserved" it versus the original photos of it (top). I kind of like it better in the original state. As the only example of this denomination that will likely ever be available, and one of the few remaining first coins minted in America, what do you think it will sell for? I can only guess somewhere north of $1 million. PCGS puts $1.5 million as a price guide, but they also put VF30 at $1 million, which is kind of funny since there is no VF30 example.

    1652_combo.jpg
     
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  9. Tall Paul

    Tall Paul Supporter! Supporter

    10-12 Million, just a guess. It's the only chance for a private person to ever own this coin.
     
  10. green18

    green18 Unknown member Sweet on Commemorative Coins Supporter

    I'll stick with moderns. They're shinier, cheaper and more plentiful. Plus they're better made.....(devil)
     
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  11. Randy Abercrombie

    Randy Abercrombie Supporter! Supporter

    You really think it could go that high? That’s amazing….. Wonder if it would be a collector or more of a speculator that will end up with it?
     
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  12. Mr. Numismatist

    Mr. Numismatist Strawberry Token Enthusiast

    I'm guessing it will sell for $2-3 million.
     
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  13. Tall Paul

    Tall Paul Supporter! Supporter

    I can see two deep pocketed individuals engaging in a bidding war. At that level of wealth the bragging rights are almost worth more than the coin.
     
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  14. SensibleSal66

    SensibleSal66 U.S Casual Collector / Error Collector

    That's more than my Bugatti Veyron. :jawdrop::rolleyes:
     
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  15. lokin4areason

    lokin4areason New Member

    thats interesting

    wondering at how they are coming up w the grade for such an item ?

    i mean , the " e " looks kind of worn down
     
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  16. SensibleSal66

    SensibleSal66 U.S Casual Collector / Error Collector

    Yea, I've seen more interesting coins, but this is history and beautifully perfect. I love raw looking coins like all new England coins like the Pine tree shilling.
     
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  17. green18

    green18 Unknown member Sweet on Commemorative Coins Supporter

    Almost sad, ain't it? Fool and his money......
     
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  18. KBBPLL

    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

    I would imagine they could compare it with the NE sixpence which used the same NE punch, but even then there are only 7 genuine examples of those known. There is a NE shilling that graded MS61 (the only unc grade I think) so that's another comparison. Good question though. It's not like a numerical grade matters - who's going to wait around for a better example?

    An AU58 NE sixpence sold for $646,250.00 ten years ago which was the record for any NE coin. 10x for this one won't surprise me - $6 million - but who knows, easily higher if Ian or that Utah guy both want it bad. Or some mysterious east coast colonial collector who wants to one-up his buddy who has the Yale coin... :)
     
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  19. green18

    green18 Unknown member Sweet on Commemorative Coins Supporter

    Skull and bones....
     
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  20. SensibleSal66

    SensibleSal66 U.S Casual Collector / Error Collector

    Huh?? Sounds like a band???
     
  21. green18

    green18 Unknown member Sweet on Commemorative Coins Supporter

    Yale boys. Heck Sal, that's your backyard....
     
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