Featured A brief history of the Pilgrim commemorative half dollar

Oh, you bought it?

I thought you got it as they landed!

 

Log in or Sign up to hide this ad.

***Fate of the Mayflower. A number of years ago they believe they found where some of the timbers from the Mayflower ended up after the ship was scrapped. I believe they were found in a Pub in England near the port that the ship was scrapped at.

***Pilgrim's clothing. The images that most people of Pilgrims in movies or depicting them in paintings is wrong. That image came from a painting done in the early 1800's. If you ever go to Plymouth Massachusetts the have a living museum built to look like it would a year or two after they arrived. The people working there are wearing period clothing and are reenactors and will only discuss things as they were on the that day in 1621 or 1622. So if you go their on September 1st 2021 they will be reenacting that day in 1621 or 1622. The information comes from documentation from time period. They will act as if they are living in those times and will act as if they have no knowledge of modern times. This is an interesting place to visit. They also have a reconstructed ship called the Mayflower11 that was built in the late 1950's in England and then sailed to Plymouth.

 

Once you go back that far, chances seem pretty good that there's some bit of Mayflower blood somewhere. I have a number of ancestors who arrived in the 1630s; I think the earliest was 1629. They all had 10-14 children (many of whom died in early childhood), they all married their friend's sister or brother or their father's friend's kid, etc. They named their kid after their friend's kid, and their friend did the same. So for example you see Thomas Dewey marry Frances Roote sister of Aaron Roote, and their kid is Aaron Dewey, then Aaron Roote's kid is named Thomas Roote, and the genealogy starts looking like spaghetti. When one son died in early childhood, the next son born got the same name. There's one in my tree that was the third kid to be named Aaron, because the first two died. In my case, by the 1660s the same bloodlines were everywhere in New England. I find it all fascinating but looking at my tree makes my head hurt.

 

I have an uncle that is heavily into genealogy. He has gone back to the 13th century. In his research, he traced the Dale line quite a ways back. I'm not good at this, but it has been discovered that we are related to a former governor of Jamestown... Sir Thomas Dale. Reading his history has been quite informative. However, Sir Thomas Dale and his family returned to England, therefore, the Dale line doesn't return to the States (as far as I know on the Dale line) until my great grandmother and her family of 7 children returned to the States via Ellis Island. My great grandmother had to find work to support her family while my grand father was put up in the infirmary on or about Ellis Island because he was sick. My great grand Father was serving in the British Army during WW I and he was killed and buried in France.
After my grand father's health was restored, My great grandmother and her children went to Indiana where other relatives were living. My grandfather was a mailman there. At 17, my father enlisted in the U.S. Navy during WWII.
It's amazing what you can find out when you follow your genealogy.
I did find out that my mother's great grandmother was a Cherokee Indiana living in western Tennessee. Her name was Nancy Ann Sytha Canatcher. My grandfather supported his family as a deputy sheriff and making "shine". He served a year then moved to Indiana and became a deputy sheriff again and supported his family by gardening to feed his family.
James W. Dale

 

Great post! Very informative!

I think those commemoratives look beautiful with that light gray shadow kind of toning. It adds depth to the coin.

 

This coin arrived today, by coincidence, the king whose activities sent the Pilgrims to Holland and then to America.


Britain James I (1603-1625) Shilling
Silver, 30 mm, 5.69 gm
Struck London Tower Mint, 1604-1605

Obverse:
Crowned bust facing right
IACOBVS D G ANG SCO FRA ET HIB REX
(James by the Grace of God, England, Scotland, France, and Ireland, King)
XII to left of bust (12 pence)

Reverse:
Shields of England, Scotland, France, and Ireland, lis mint mark
EXVRGAT DEVS DISSIPENTVR INIMICI
(Let God arise, let his enemies be scattered)

 

I just wanted to say how great and enjoyable this thread has been. I have never been a classic commemorative guy, but that ship on the coin is bending my arm harshly! Very informative and thanks for the read, all!

 

Neat thread. My German ancestors immigrated to America in 1754 aboard an English ship - which has nothing to do with the first classic commemorative I ever bought.

 

Just looking at that pic again and noticed it almost looks like a gold coin. O_O

 

@lordmarcovan Really enjoyed that post. You make an excellent point on genealogy. When you go back that far the population was minuscule compared to what it is today. So it makes sense that a relatively large portion of the population could be descendants of Mayflower passengers. I need to go back to that book and find a few more tidbits for this thread. I know there are some interesting original artifacts still around from it. Some that have stayed in families through the generations. If I remember right I think there is an original firearm out there that someone has with an interesting story. Passed down through the generations and not exactly treated as a museum piece. If I remember I think somebody left it in a corner behind a door in their house for a while.

 

Actually it has "deep, golden toning," probably from being dipped long ago. It's in an NGC old fatty holder which is probably close to 30 years old.

 

It's just factors of 2. So three generations ago, great-grandparents, is 2^3=8. 38 generations back to William the Conqueror is 2^38, which equals just under 275 billion people. This is where the math thing falls apart - nobody has that many ancestors.

It's also interesting for me to contemplate the "wealth" thing. Going back into the 1700s, some of my ancestors were very wealthy, for the times. They owned farms and mills and expanded into new economic activities as Europeans pushed west. They founded entire towns! And yet all of my grandparents basically grew up dirt poor. Funny how that generational wealth trickles one way and not another, and I'm sure many ancestors along the way also lost their fortunes.

 

It's a lot easier to make yourself poor than to make yourself rich, or even remain rich. Managing investment assets is a major challenge, especially now.

 

I can only trace my roots back to 1652, my ancestor was the ship captain's cabin boy (he was 15).

Here are my '20 & '21 Pilgrims, and then a tip o' the hat to the Huguenots (that's what my aforementioned ancestor was);

 

My grandmother's genealogy hints at one reason. Her grandfather's great-grandfather came here from Ireland some time in the mid-late 1700s, angry at his family because he was a younger son and the first-born inherited everything, so he was out of luck. He even changed his last name when he got here, from Malloy to Logue. His son married into the Dewey family, which down the road produced Admiral George Dewey of Spanish-American War fame, and Thomas Dewey, famous for his 1948 presidential run. I guess my point is that probably everyone's family tree branched into famous and wealthy people, due to things like being the first-born, but here I am, able to buy a nice coin once in a while, same as you.

 

Here's my example that I received a couple of days ago. Graded MS65 by PCGS. I really like the dynamism of the Mayflower on the reverse.

Bit unsure if I'll keep it or return this one though. I think the strike is great, but the dark toning at 11 o'clock on the reverse is more prominent and distracting in person than in either these or the sellers pictures. With the mintage figures, I think I should be able to find one I like more without too much trouble. How do people find the toning on these coins generally?

 

Since they only minted approx 30,000 1921 coins, did not sell all of them,
and returned some to be melted. And there are millions of collectors, why isn't the demand and price higher for this coin?

 

Well, I guess it's probably because there are a 150,000 1920 Pilgrims minted, and most collectors are happy with either one? I expect there's very few people attempting a full date set of the classic commemoratives.

And honestly, looking at mintage figures and prices, I think there's a surprisingly small number of people trying to build even a type set of the classic commemoratives. I picked up a 1936 Lynchburg (mintage 20,000) in MS65 for around 220$ recently. AFAIK among the types it's only the Hawaiian which goes for crazy prices (2k+ for an MS64), with the Hudson and Spanish trail costing a pretty penny as well. The rest are reasonably affordable to pick up in gem grades over time.