Medieval Monday!

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by FitzNigel, Sep 14, 2020.

  1. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    Magnificent, @seth77 --BTW, good to see you back, after a minute! Yes, starting with scarce issues --as it's hard to doubt your examples are-- the historical context Just Gets to take precedence. ...For yours truly, that's '...Full Stop.'
     
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  3. seth77

    seth77 Well-Known Member

    Yes thank you, I'm sorry I missed Saturday Night Free for All. My daughter has been under the weather and that is even more angst-inducing these days than it would normally be.
     
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  4. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    ...Duly sending the kind of vibage toward your daughter of which I'm capable.
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2021
    seth77 likes this.
  5. Aunduril

    Aunduril Well-Known Member

    My first purchases of 2021:

    [​IMG]

    ALFONSO XI.
    1312-1350

    [​IMG]

    Alfonso X.
    1252-1284
     
  6. TTerrier

    TTerrier Well-Known Member

    Here is a 6 ghani billon coin of Ala al-din Muhammad, one of the Delhi sultans. There is a great write-up on this sultan already with a very nice coin here https://www.cointalk.com/threads/sultans-of-delhi-ala-al-din-muhammad-aka-alauddin-khilji.366921/

    This is a much more pedestrian coin but still a good example of the medieval Islamic sultanates.

    Ala al-din Muhammad, 6 ghani, 3.60 gm, 14mm AH714, AD1314 ref D232
    Note that some of the words extend over two lines, such as "al-dunya" on the obverse

    Ala al-din Mohammad 6 gani AH714A obv D232.jpg Ala al-din Mohammad 6 gani AH714A obverse D232.jpg
    Ala al-din Mohammad 6 gani AH714A rev D232.jpg Ala al-din Mohammad 6 gani AH714A reverse D232.jpg
     

    Attached Files:

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  7. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    Splendid examples, @Aunduril. I've collected up to Alfonso IX; with that as an available frame of reference, those are Solid as Get-Out.
    And @TTerrier, I only wish I had a scrap of the fluency in Arabic, and languages, Semitic and farther east, that you and some of our other esteemed colleagues here have. In reference, for one, to my first post for today. I felt like issuing a dislaimer: 'I have no idea what the Arabic legends mean.'
    ...Now, watch while I do the same thing again. (Yes, here, it's very much still Monday.) In particular deference to @Ryro and @panzerman, here are my two intact (as struck, minus clipping) AV taris. ...Honest, though, if anyone can help with any of the Arabic (including the earlier post, the fractional dinar of Valencia), my appreciation would be as profuse and profound as it would be (...no less inexorably?) insufficient.
    COINS, ITALY, 11TH-C. IMITATIVE TARI.jpg
    I'll just copy and paste the dealer's description and references:
    Anonymous, Amalfi or Salerno (Pseudo-Kufic) c. 1000-1050, Pseudo-Kufic legend around central pellet / Pseudo-Kufic legend around central pellet,
    9 mm, 0, 56 g
    Cf. Grierson-Travaini 38 (Amalfi); cf. Biaggi 14 (Amalfi)
    In other words, this is from the eve of the Norman conquest of the southern Italian mainland (Salerno, Apulia and Calabria), imitating a recent Fatimid-era prototype.
    For those, here's one likely suspect:
    https://www.zeno.ru/showphoto.php?photo=251200

    COINS, ISLAMIC SICILY, FATIMID FRACTIONAL DINAR, TARI, al-Mansur, OBV..jpg COINS, ISLAMIC SICILY, FATIMID FRACTIONAL DINAR, TARI, al-Mansur, REV..jpg
    This is of al-Mustansir billah, a nominal Fatimid vassal in Sicily, AH 427-487; 1036-1094 ACE. Siquilliyah mint (renamed Palermo ...after giving its name to the island). Issued on the eve of the conquest of the island by Robert Guiscard and his brother Roger. (Album 722.)
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2021
  8. Orielensis

    Orielensis Well-Known Member

    I very much like these! High medieval Sicily is, as far as I see, the only Western medieval region that used a trimetallic (gold, silver, bronze) currency system similar to that of the Roman Empire. The rest of medieval Europe either relied solely on silver coins or occasionally supplemented silver with imported gold.

    My contribution for this medieval Monday is much later and comes from north of the Alps. In the 15th century, different episcopal and civic mints in Germany followed the trend towards larger silver denominations and struck gros-like coins. In 1443, the Franconian mints, the margraves of Hohenzollern, and the bishopric of Würzburg started a currency union and issued heavy schillinge as an alternative to the Bohemian and Saxon groschen that dominated superregional trade. This coin, my last 2020 purchase, is a nice example:

    MA – Deutschland etc., Würzburg, Schilling, G. Schenk von Limpurg.png
    Bishopric of Würzburg, under Gottfried Schenk von Limpurg, AR schilling, 1443–1453. Obv: SANCTVS * KILIANVS *; St. Kilian, mitred and nimbate, standing facing with sword and crosier. Rev: +MON’ * ARGE’ * HERBIPOLENS’ *; shield (arms of the bishop). 25mm, 2.11g. Ref: Ehwald 5601.
     
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  9. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    Just posted this on @Muhammad Niazi's thread, "The Persian Dragon" (https://www.cointalk.com/threads/the-persian-dragon.369846/), ...but, why not? Just found the pics (unlabelled, buried in "Camera Uploads"). COINS, GERMANY, BAYERN, REGENSBERG, HEINRICH X, DRAGON.JPG
    Duchy of Bavaria, Heinrich X the Proud (a Welf), 1126-1140. Denar of Regensburg.
    Rev. Soldier with 'Norman,' kite-shaped shield, helmet with nose-guard, and sword, fighting a dragon ...of which all you get is the tail and two hind legs.
    Obv. Heinrich standing facing, holding banner and shield.
    Typically indifferent strike, but better than the example in this article from Academia.edu (unnumbered pages; you'd have to Really Scroll to find it):
    https://www.academia.edu/24323600/Medieval_Coins_of_Bavaria
    For references, to cut to the chase, the author cites Emerig 71. ...Betting it's in one of my auction catalogs, but it wasn't in the two most likely suspects, nor in Kluge.
    I like how the style evokes the nearly contemporaneous Bohemian one with which @FitzNigel started this thread.
     
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  10. svessien

    svessien Senior Member

    Yay, Medieval Monday!

    I was very happy to receive this coin a week ago:

    France Charles VII.jpg
    Charles VII 1422-1461 Blanc a la Couronne 1ere emission 28 Janiver 1436
    Obverse: + KAROLVS FRANCORVM REX
    Reverse: + SIT NOME DNI BENEDICTVM, Cross cantonee with two crowns and two fleur de lis within quadrilobe.
    POINT 5e ATELIER TOULOUSE POIDS 2.77g / NUMERO CATALOGUE: DUP519 / QUALITE: TTB.

    Charles VII sure didn’t have an easy way to the top. Read some fun facts about his miserable family life and struggle to re-establish control of the realm here:
    https://www.factinate.com/people/charles-vii/

    Growing up with a father named «the mad» and a mother known to be of «loose morals» did make good old Charles used to handle diversity, though. And the issue of the Blanc a la Couronne was one of his measures to deal with the calamities his father had brought upon France:

    «Charles VI had started with a coinage of gold and good quality billon, but no silver, and the monetary consequences of the disasters of the early years of the century can best be illustrated by the history of the florette, the billon coin which in October 1417 replaced the guenar. It had initially a value of 20dt, weighed 3.06g and had a fineness of 425/1000. By July 1422, after 21 issues, its weight had fallen to 2.04g and its fineness to 26/1000,the lowest of any French coin in the Middle Ages. This was exceptional, but the «silver» and billon coins in general varied a great deal in fineness. There was, indeed, only only one denomination of good silver (917/1000), the gros-de-roi of Jaques Coeur (1447), struck at all in the century: most coins were substantionally below 500/1000 fine. The types were for the most part banal, usually one or more fleur-de-lis, or the shield of France in a tressure of some kind, though occasionally there would be a crowned K (for Karolus) or L (for Ludovicus). Charles VII carried out a general reorganization of the coinage in 1436, after his recapture of Paris, with an Ecu neuf of 25s having crowned fleurs de lis flanking the crowned shield of the obverse type and a blanc de couronelles of 10d with three small crowns around a shield in a threfoil. The worst was over by then for the French coinage

    P. Grierson, «Coins of Medieval Europe», p. 192-93.

    In addition to adding a fine coin with some historical significance, I can now enjoy one of my childish little quirks, which is to have two opponents side by side in my collection. There’s Cnut vs. Aethelred and now Henry VI vs. Charles VII, «the Victorious»
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2021
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  11. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    @svessien, that's just Too Good. Both for the coin, and for your valued historical context.
     
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  12. svessien

    svessien Senior Member

    I find it exactly good enough, so I’m feeling some kind of numismatic contentment. :)

    B27455A8-800B-452A-BCF3-EC614D575242.jpeg
     
  13. panzerman

    panzerman Well-Known Member

    Here is mine from Hamburg/ PGGS has it as a Dukat:shame:
    AV Goldgulden 1497 Hamburg Mint lf (45).jpg lf (46).jpg
     
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  14. FitzNigel

    FitzNigel Medievalist

    Guess I need to post another Bohemian coin... (I’ve been avoiding this one because I need to retake the picture. Oh well.)
    Med-15-Boh-1061-Vratislaus II-D-B-10-9.jpg Bohemia
    Vratislaus II, r. 1061-1092 (1085-1092)
    Prague Mint, AR Denar, 16.21 mm x 0.8 grams
    Obv.: S WRATIZLV. Crowned bust right
    Rev.: S WENCEZLV. Hand holding a standard, stylized building to the right
    Ref.: Frynas B.10.9; De Wit 2729, cf. Lanz Graz XIII, 172-183
    Note: Issued as King of Bohemia
     
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  15. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    @FitzNigel, No, the pic is Just Fine!!!
    ...Are you up too late? With your schedule, some of us worry....
     
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  16. Henry112345

    Henry112345 Member

    That’s a nice coin . the following picture is one of my favorite medieval coin from crusader state principality of Antioch.
     

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  17. FitzNigel

    FitzNigel Medievalist

    not up too late - just busy. I tend to get this was during the school year. I’m around, but usually lurking more. Thanks for the concern!
     
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  18. FitzNigel

    FitzNigel Medievalist

    I didn’t forget today! Since I am covering the Carolingians in class today, I thought it would be appropriate to post the closest thing I have to that topic:
    Med-01-Car-920-Anon-D-XX.jpg Early Medieval - Carolingian Normandy
    Anonymous (Viking/Rollo-William Longsword), 10th c. (920s)
    AR Denier, 16mm x 0.57 grams
    Obv.: Counterclockwise legend +DOVVICVSIMP around small cross
    Rev.: Clockwise legend XRISTIANA REL around temple
    Note: Imitation of a Louis the Pious denier

    this was my top purchase last year, and you can read the write-up here.
     
  19. svessien

    svessien Senior Member

    Wow..... I got jealous. Instantly. Not hard to understand that this was top of 2020 for you.
     
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  20. Orielensis

    Orielensis Well-Known Member

    Nice coin – and I bet your students will love the class. It's impossible to not be fascinated by the early Middle Ages. A former professor of mine once stressed that Plato's Athens, Alexander's empire, Caesar's Rome, and Charlemagne's Francia were the four main points in Western history that continue to hold what he called 'myth-making power.' The older I get, the more I'm convinced that for better or worse he was right.

    And of course I'll not pass on the chance of showing my Carolingian denier again:
    MA – Frankreich, Karolinger, Karld der Kahle, denier.png
    Western Carolingian Empire, Charles the Bald, AR denier, 840–877 AD, "Curtisasonien" mint (Courcessin or Courgeon). Obv: +CRATIA D-I REX; Karolus monogram. Rev: +HCVRTISASONIEH; cross. 19.5mm, 1.69g. Ref: MEC I, 860–864.
     
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  21. robp

    robp Well-Known Member

    John class Vb/Va mule penny of Winchester. IOHAN ON WINC
    upload_2021-1-25_14-9-8.jpeg
     
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