Democrat versus Republican

I would guess that most people who collect coins are also interested in government. There have been endless discussions, (in ancient times the discussions could lead to discombobulation in the Agora or Forum), as to which government produced the finest and best in their citizenry. Well, I don't know if we can settle that but we can ask whether a Democratic or Republican polity produced the best coinage, best, in this case, being the most striking, beautiful or noteworthy, so I propose we post the best example of our coin collections, one from a democratic Greek city-state (yes, I know most were monarchies, oligarchies or tyrannies but we'll consider democracy to be the ideal of the Greek state) and one from the Roman Republic. Below I have posted a stater from Velia in Magna Graecia with Athena and a crouching lion as my most fetching democratic coin. It was minted about 300 BC. (Sear 269). Competing with that is my very pleasing Republican denarius of circa 79 BC with the ever beautiful Diana Artemis with Victory galloping down the final lap to..., well, victory. (Sear 310). After endless contemplation. I declare a tie and leave it to others to post their best Democratic Greek and best Republican Roman and see if we can achieve homeostasis as to which kind of state produces the best coinage.

 

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Well from your title, this is not where I thought this thread would be heading lol.

That is a really neat comparison.

 

I don't appear to have any democratic coins, but here's a republican:

 

ALEXANDER III
AR Drachm
OBVERSE: Head of Herakles right in lionskin headdress
REVERSE: ALEXANDROU, Zeus Aetophoros seated left, holding eagle and sceptre. Forepart of Pegasos left in left field, X on W monogram beneath throne
Struck at Abydos 325-323 BC
4.2g, 17mm
Price 1505

VS


ANONYMOUS ROMAN REPUBLIC
AR Didrachm
OBVERSE: Helmeted head of Mars left, oak-sprig behind
REVERSE: ROMANO on tablet below head of bridled horse right, ear of wheat behind
Struck at Metapontum, 280-276 BC
19 mm, 6.55g
Cr13/1, Syd 1

 

Now that coin is a beauty but that's not a fair comparison. Your Victory rated a FOUR horse chariot but if it's a win by a hoof mine is ahead on that final lap.

 

Republican :




Democrat (I thought the following would do the job as a donkey-ish. Thank you Pegasus for pretending )



Q

 

Democratic Athens:

Attica, Athens, AR tetradrachm, ca. 440s–430s BC. Obv: head of Athena to right, wearing crested Attic helmet decorated with three olive leaves and palmette. Rev: AΘE; Owl standing right, head facing; to left, olive sprig and crescent; all within incuse square. 24mm, 17.14g. Ref: Kroll 8. Ex Leu, Webauktion 8, lot 232.

Republican Rome:

Roman Republic, moneyer: C. Marius C. f. Capito, AR denarius serratus, 81 BC, Rome mint. Obv: CAPIT; head of Ceres, diademed, r., control number CV; control mark (whip?) before. Rev: C. MARI. C. F. / S. C; ploughman with two oxen l.; above, control number CV. 18mm, 3.88g. Ref: RRC 378/1c. Ex Numismatik Naumann, Auktion 49, lot 518.

Macedonian Monarchy:

Alexander III "the Great," Kingdom of Macedonia, Ar tetradrachm, 325–323 BC, Amphipolis mint (under Antipater). Obv: Head of Herakles right, wearing lion skin. Rev: ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΥ, Zeus Aëtophoros seated left; in left field, rooster standing left. 26mm, 17.17g. Ref: Price 79; Troxell 1997, issue E3. Ex CNG, e-auction 376, lot 47; ex Tiberius collection; ex AMCC 1, lot 39.

Feudal Holy Roman Empire:

Prince-Bishopric of Augsburg, under Wolfhard von Roth-Wackernitz, AR bracteate penny, ca. 1290–1330. Obv: bust of bishop facing, wearing mitre, holding crosier and book. Rev: negative design (bracteate). 20.5mm, 0.66g. Ref: Berger 2656–2661; Slg Bonhoff 1919; Steinhilber 94. Ex Emporium Hamburg, Auction 80, lot 1984.

"When things went pear-shaped:"

"Tetricus I" or similar, barbarous radiate, late 3rd century AD, unofficial mint in Gaul or Britain. Obv: [...] I II II, bearded, radiate head r. Rev: V I [...]; human figure riding on stag l.; 13–14mm, 1.38g. Ex Ken Dorney.

 

Democracy


SYRACUSE. Second Democracy, 466-405 BC
Æ Tetras, 2.7g, 15mm; c.425 BC.
Obv.: Head of Arethusa right, hair in korymbos, dolphin before and behind, ΣVPA before; all in linear circle.
Rev.: Octopus and three pellets.
Reference: SNG ANS 376, Calciati II.21.1, Bérend Pl.VI.11


Republic


RR Anon 234-231 BCE AR Heavy Denarius / Didrachm Apollo-Horse prancing Crawford 26-1 Sear 28

 

Interesting thread @kevin McGonigal . I like the gryphon helmet.
I will go a bit different way with RR coins:

Heads only:

I have lots more elephants than donkeys.

 

I don't know about beauty, but this is one of the more interesting coins I have from the Roman Republic era.




This is an American coin, but it's relevant because Theodore Roosevelt was looking to emulate the high relief Greek coins when he asked Augustus St. Gaudens to replace the “atrociously hideous” U.S. coin designs.



Given that the Roman coins were hammer strikes, it is remarkable that they were able to get good high relief porttaits on the majority of their coins. Here is a denarius of Hadrian. in this case, both sides struck up well.

 

That didrachma is a good example of how Romans could make an attractive coin. I wonder, though, if was designed and actually minted by Greek Celators from Magna Graecia.

 

I wish we could go back in time and see how they did it. And yes, the Us did produce some quite attractive "Classic coins" like the quarter eagle and half eagle of the 1830's.

 

Democratic. Republican

 

I understand this one was the first Silver minted in Rome at the Rome mint.


RR Anon 265-242 BCE Heavy Denarius / Didrachm Roma-Victory Crawford 22-1 Sear 25 - First Silver coin MINTED in Rome

 

Can anyone show an ancient coin of a republic other than Rome? .... a democracy other than Athens? ... a system other than those two or a monarchy?

 

Are there other examples? I can show modern examples, but I'm not sure of other ancient ones.

 

As the OP of this thread I hereby sanction the coinage of other ancient states. I know that several Athenian colonies had democracies and some which are described as oligarchies may actually have been representative republics, something like medieval Venice. And certainly when a mob took over the Hippodrome in Byzantium the Eastern Roman Empire became something of a democracy, at least for a day or two.

 

Direct Limited Democracy: Athens



Brutal military dictatorship: Syracuse



Republic: Rome




Absolute Monarchy: Seleucid Empire




Imperial government with fictional power sharing between institutions: Rome during the Principate



Imperial government without the pretence of power sharing: Rome during the Dominate




Barbarian tribal council-based government: Armorica tribe in Gaul



Federal democracy: Euboean League



Imperial government ruled by the son of heaven, and a living divinity himself: Ancient China

 

I wonder if we did not know about these images from historical records, just what we could conclude about the rulers, the forms of government and the people who issued them. By the way, that Amorican coin might actually represent as pure or direct democracy as anything in ancient Athens.

 

I just posted an additional one, the Euboean League, whose member city states shared a common council with elected representatives who were responsible for creating and maintaining a common system of laws and customs, and shared coinage, and a federal military force that protected all the member states. Probably as close as the ancients got to our federal systems today, or even an EU type government, but on a far smaller and much simpler scale obviously. When it comes to bureaucratic nightmare and unwieldy international institutions, we are far more accomplished at it than our ancestors were.