Featured Visit to the Harzhorn Battlefield and Göttingen Coin Cabinet

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Julius Germanicus, May 14, 2018.

  1. lordmarcovan

    lordmarcovan Eclectic & Eccentric Moderator

    I've only had that experience here in the southern US, but I must say, climbing down into The Crater at twilight was a haunting experience.

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    Funny how much that last photo looks like WW1, doesn't it?
     
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  3. chrisild

    chrisild Coin Collector

    When you plan your trip, keep in mind that the Sky Disk is usually exhibited in Halle but, between mid/late September and early November, can be seen in Berlin. There will be an Archaeology in Germany exhibition (Martin-Gropius-Bau, next to the Topography of Terror) then ...

    By the way, in Nebra they have a Sky Disk Run every year, and every finisher gets a medal which is a replica (Ø 5 cm) of the real thing. ;)

    Christian
     
  4. rrdenarius

    rrdenarius non omnibus dormio Supporter

    Great write-up, thanks for sharing.
     
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  5. Deacon Ray

    Deacon Ray Artist & Historian Supporter

    Wow, yes the Crater was definitely a premonition of the horror of modern warfare. What a tragic event! We have some of the bloodiest Civil War battlefields here in Maryland, Virginia, and Pennsylvania but your home state of Georgia has plenty of Hallowed ground and was the site of many desperate heroic battles of the Civil War such as Chickamauga, Atlanta, Kennesaw Mountain, Ezra Church and so on. And earlier battlefields of the American Revolution and the valor and sacrifice displayed by British, French, and American forces during the Siege of Savannah.

    "Uncommon valor was a common virtue" ~Admiral Chester Nimitz

    Now, since my post was a bit off topic I must follow the CTAF tradition of displaying an ancient coin as compensation. This coin is from a desperate period in Judaean history,

    SHEKEL.jpg
     
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  6. Alegandron

    Alegandron "ΤΩΙ ΚΡΑΤΙΣΤΩΙ..." ΜΕΓΑΣ ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΣ, June 323 BCE

    I lived a couple miles from Stones River Battlefield. Eerie visting, when they fought in the rock formations, it got brutal. Here are my daughters on a Caisson at the battlefield (yeah, 30+ years ago...)... and my Dog Bucephalus (Bucy)

    upload_2018-5-29_13-32-9.png
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2018
  7. Bing

    Bing Illegitimi non carborundum Supporter

    Beautiful little girls and I love the name of your dog.
     
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  8. Alegandron

    Alegandron "ΤΩΙ ΚΡΑΤΙΣΤΩΙ..." ΜΕΓΑΣ ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΣ, June 323 BCE

    Thank you. LOL, I was fortuante to get her up on the Caisson... she was heavier than both kids COMBINED! The kids had a ball, the dog was.. "I don't care..." Both of them have kids OLDER than when they were in this pic. I also really miss Bucy. She was a sweetie! She was the only dog I had with AKC Papers... Bucephalus Alexandria.
     
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  9. Bing

    Bing Illegitimi non carborundum Supporter

  10. Bing

    Bing Illegitimi non carborundum Supporter

    Don't you wish they were little again. I miss my sons from that age.
     
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  11. Alegandron

    Alegandron "ΤΩΙ ΚΡΑΤΙΣΤΩΙ..." ΜΕΓΑΣ ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΣ, June 323 BCE

    OMG, it is TOUGH looking at all their pics when they were little ones!!! So many memories, laughs, and great times. I work with the little blonde now. She is a DYNAMO at work, and she is semi-pro Roller Derby as her hobby! And to think she was a very shy little girl, and a snuggler as a baby...

    Love your Bucephalus post... the story of Alexander's horse was why I named my dog after his horse.
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2018
  12. Bart9349

    Bart9349 Junior Member

    Thank you, again, Julius Germanicus for the interesting post.

    I believe the coin on display (with the enlarged photo of the coin behind) is of Julia Mamaea. That would be one of of the important pieces of evidence that the battle at Harzhorn occurred no earlier than 222 CE. (Her son Alexander Severus was emperor 222-235 CE. Both mother and emperor were murdered by disgruntled troops in 235 CE.)

    coinA.jpg

    Can anyone more accurately identify and date this coin?

    Julius Germanicus, do you have any other pictures (especially closeups) of the later issue coins?
     
  13. Bart9349

    Bart9349 Junior Member

    Not wanting to hijack this excellent thread ...

    Professor Pearson noted in his book on Maximinus Thrax that an axe-head was found at the Harzhorn battlefield with the inscription leg IIII SA on one side and FAV on the other. This identifies the legio IIII flavia felix. The symbol of the unit was a lion. The initials SA probably signifies severinae alexandrinae (Severus Alexander).

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legio_IV_Flavia_Felix

    (Not my coin. Not my picture.)
    legio IIII.jpg
    Antoninianus minted under Carausius. On the reverse, the lion, symbol of the legion, and the legend LEG IIII FL.




    By sheer coincidence, the unit commanded by Russel Crowe in the movie Gladiator during the battle in Germania (set more than a half century earlier) was legio III, felix legion (symbol also a lion).

    GladiatorA.gif

    Banner.jpg

    bannerA.jpg
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2018
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  14. Julius Germanicus

    Julius Germanicus Well-Known Member


    The coins on display at the site are replicas of a random coins by Alexander, Julia Mamaea, and Maximinus. There are no original artifacts displayed at the Harzhorn exhibition due to the risk of theft.

    This is the actual coin of Julia that has been found at the battle site:

    Bildschirmfoto 2018-05-30 um 09.39.48.jpg

    IVLIA MAMAEA AVG / VENERI FELICI, Denarius, RIC 351

    There were also Denarii of Severus Alexander (MARTI PACIFERO, RIC 160 and IOVI VLTORI, RIC 144) and a provincial bronze of his amongst various coins of Commodus, Septimius Severus and his sons, and Elagabalus.

    Bildschirmfoto 2018-05-30 um 09.55.43.jpg

    Severus Alexander, Nakaia in Bithynia, BMC 104

    The latest of these has been dated to 228 a.D.
     
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  15. Julius Germanicus

    Julius Germanicus Well-Known Member

    This is it:

    Bildschirmfoto 2018-05-30 um 10.04.54.png
     
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  16. rrdenarius

    rrdenarius non omnibus dormio Supporter

    Interesting how dating with coins is used. I picked up a lot of similar coins in a recent CNG auction. They must be relatively common.
    DSCN1772.JPG
    DSCN1779.JPG
     
  17. Bart9349

    Bart9349 Junior Member

    My simple mind requires a simplistic explanation (in cartoon form, no less) of the research surrounding the Harzhorn battle site.



     
    Last edited: May 30, 2018
  18. Orfew

    Orfew Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus

    Great videos. thanks for posting these.
     
  19. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    Max Thrax FTW!

    Maximinus Salus Sestertius.jpg
     
  20. Al Kowsky

    Al Kowsky Well-Known Member

    Julius Germanicus, Thanks for a well written & informative article :). I spent 18 months in Germany in the late 1960s after a tour of duty in Viet Nam, long before the battle site of Harzhorn was discovered :(. I did get to see the Roman ruins in the city of Trier & was blown-away by what I saw :jawdrop:. There is no doubt that Maximinus Thrax & his troops were the legionnaires in the Battle of Harzhorn, but it's my understanding that no coins from this emperor have been found at the site. Doesn't that seem odd o_O?
     
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  21. chrisild

    chrisild Coin Collector

    Huh? They did find coins there. Without them, it would have been tougher to find out when that battle was ...

    Christian
     
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