Overpaid, But Overly Pleased

In a recent topic, https://www.cointalk.com/threads/thoughts-about-value.316380/page-3#post-3085500 I mentioned I had recently overpaid for a coin that I desperately wanted/needed. Well, it finally arrived and I am very pleased to share it now.



Vespasian
AR Denarius, 3.29g
Ephesus Mint, 71 AD
RIC 1432 (R2). BMC p. 96 *. RSC 281. RPC 834 (2 spec.).
Obv: IMP CAESAR VESPAS AVG COS III TR P P P; Head of Vespasian, laureate, r.
Rev: PACI AVGVSTAE; Victory adv. l., with wreath and palm; at lower l., EPHE

The Victory advancing left was a commonly struck reverse type at Ephesus up until Vespasian's COS III issue. From this issue going forward, the mint favoured Victory advancing right and sparingly struck the advancing left variant. As a matter of fact, the left Victory virtually disappears by the time the COS V issue was produced. So, a very rare type for COS III - just 2 Victory left specimens versus 14 right specimens cited in RPC. Engraved in fabulous Ephesian style!

The curse of being a specialist is that sometimes you will overpay to get a desired type. Sure, it momentarily hurts the pocketbook, but it would hurt even more if the coin was missing from the collection!

Feel free to share your overpaid gems.

 

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I really love that not only is the portrait in Ephesian style but so is Victory, It's a wonderful coin David. These eastern mint Falvians are addictive

 

How do you put a price on a rare beauty like that? No wonder why you had to pull the trigger!

 

Messed up the conversion rate and forgot about the buyer’s premium.

 

Those Ephesus issues are so beautiful and this is no exception. What a marvelous portrait!

Hmm, "overpaid" is a tricky word. In many instances I've paid more than I wanted to pay but I bid what I had to bid to acquire the coin.

Here are a few such examples:


EGYPT, Alexandria. Domitian. Regnal year 10, CE 90/91. Æ diobol (25mm, 10.86 g, 12h). AVT KAICAP ΔΟ ΜΙΤ CEB ΓΕΡΜ, laureate head right / Agathodaemon serpent, wearing the skhent crown (emblematic of upper and lower Egypt), on horseback galloping left; L I (date) below. Köln –; Dattari (Savio) –; K&G 24.109; RPC II 2585; SNG Copenhagen 214; Emmett 277.10 (R5).
Ex Giovanni Maria Staffieri Collection
Ex West Coast/Lloyd Beauchaine Collection (Classical Numismatic Group 41, 19 March 1997), lot 1110
Ex Classical Numismatic Review Vol. XVI, No. 1 (January 1991), lot 31
Ex Numismatic Fine Arts Fall Mail Bid Sale (18 October 1990), lot 2365
Appearances:
Staffieri, Alexandria In Nummis 39 (this coin)
Obverse illustrated in Emmett as the header for the Domitian section, p. 24 (this coin)
Fully illustrated in Emmett, p. 26 (this coin, discussing the unusual reverse).
https://www.cointalk.com/threads/so-these-exist-snake-cowboys.314032/



SICILY, Syracuse. Agathokles (317-289 BCE)
struck 310-305 BCE
AR tetradrachm, 17.40 g, 24 mm
Obv: head of the nymph Arethusa left, wearing grain wreath, earring and necklace; around, three dolphins; under, monogram (NK?)
Rev: ΣYPAKOΣIΩN, fast chariot charioteer leads to left, holding reins and kentron; above, triskeles; in exergue, monogram
Ref: Ierardi 12 (O2-R8); SNG Copenhagen 573 var., SNG ANS 637
https://www.cointalk.com/threads/ancient-adventures-in-bidland-agathokles-tetradrachm.243930/



SICILY, Selinos.
Circa 410 BCE
AR litra, 11mm, 0.76 g, 1h
Obv: nymph seated left on rock, right hand raised above her head, extending her left hand to touch coiled serpent before her; selinon leaf above
Rev: man-faced bull standing right; ΣEΛINONTIOΣ above; in exergue, fish right
Ref: Potamikon, p. 116 figure 152 (this coin); HGC 2, 1229; SNG ANS 711–2 var. (ethnic); SNG Ashmolean 1904–5; SNG Lloyd 1270 var. (same); Basel –; Dewing –; Rizzo pl. XXXIII, 6. Rare.
ex MoneyMuseum, Zurich;
ex Leu 79 (31 October 2000), lot 404;
ex Athos Moretti collection, #482, unpublished manuscript.
https://www.cointalk.com/threads/selinos-litra-this-tiny-coin-has-it-all.258915/


BRUTTIUM, the Brettii
216-214 BCE
Æ quartuncia, 13.5mm, 2.06 g
Obv: head of Amphitrite left, wearing crab headdress
Rev: crab; torch above, BPET-TIΩN above and below
Ref: Pfeiler p. 33, 4a; Scheu, Bronze 51; HN Italy 1944; SNG ANS 123–4; SNG Lloyd –; McClean 1579
https://www.cointalk.com/threads/a-bronze-of-the-brettii-poseidons-wife.274722/

Perhaps it's easier to use the term "overpaid" for coins that are relatively easy to find in the market place and that in an average state of preservation, where recently sold comparisons are abundant. It becomes much harder to assign the term to coins that are rare or in unusually good states of preservation or of high artistry.

I'm very good at forgetting about how much I overpaid for some coins .

 

What is the latest theory on the difference between EPHE and BY coins?


Overpaid? That is so much a matter of opinion. Since we have no expectation of selling such coins, it will make no matter whether anyone else wants the coins.

My biggest overpay was a lot of 27 Alexandrian tets. I wanted a few of them to some degree but mostly bought the lot to get the one Julia Domna showing her two sons shaking hands. Dated LK year 20, it was issued after the last day of August 211. Caracalla killed Geta in December 211. As far as I know, this is the only coin that shows both boys that was issued after the death of Septimius. There are several from their younger years when dad was promoting brotherly love. I discovered there is a coin dated year 18 using the same obverse die so I doubt many were made in that period. I have showed it here too often. Which figure is Geta? Sooner or later I'll find someone who likes it like I do.

 

I don't think you overpaid! As noted, you're not selling them, but if you were to individually sell those coins, the Septimius, Domna, and Caracalla issues alone would likely cover the cost of the whole lot. I remain envious of your win. That Domna with Geta and Caracalla-- just wow.

 

Due to the nice toning I (slightly)overpaid for these 2 coins:

 

According to RIC II.1 and RPC II, all Flavian denarii from Asia Minor are now attributed to Ephesus. The various mint marks are attributed to one mint based on die links, shared types, and similar style. They likely represent different issues from the same mint instead of separate issues from several cities. Ephesus is thought to be the location because of the EPHE mark used on the COS III issue.

 

Agreed. I am sure there are some who would see the price and think it reasonable, others would want the coin for half that. I fall somewhere in the middle ... but my specialist tendencies got in the way and I pulled the trigger anyway. No regrets, even though this was no bargain!

 

Coins are luxury purchases.

I never overpay. I pay what I feel the coins are worth at the time I capture them. It is possible that I paid more than what I expected, but I WANTED the coin (not NEEDED the coin), and paid the money. I was never forced, and it is always my choice.

If I were out of food, and I had to pay 5x its worth due to someone KNOWING I was out of food, that is overpaying.

EDIT: And John @Theodosius NAILED my thoughts in his post below. Meant to say what he said, and forgot when I posted!


Etruria Populonia 3rd C BCE AR 20 As 8-1g Metus Blank HN 152

 

Wonderful, very nice, David.

 

That is a beauty!

I tend to forget what I paid for my favorite coins while I still regret years later not buying certain coins that rarely come to market.

John

 

An awesome addition!

 

I agree with @TIF . "Overpaid" is tricky. I am cheap, but I also notice that the coins I "overpay" for usually are the ones giving me the greatest joy of owning. All of my gVF/XF coins like my avatar I probably "overpaid" for I simply love to take out and look at. Other coins are the same. Other coins, which may have been a "good deal", I simply do not find myself looking at as often, and don't feel the same pride of ownership.

Do you love the coin? Do you get great pleasure of owning it? Those are the keys. The price paid for a coin dissipates over time in my experience.

Congrats on the purchase OP. I love it when a true collector gets a piece he has really been desiring.

 

Uh, yeah, I don't think you can technically overpay when you both paid what was acceptable to you & at the same time love the coin. If you overpaid, you would have bought one a long time ago.

Only "modern" collectors will receive a coin that is much nicer than they expected, and yet claim they overpaid.

I don't think it's applicable on this forum (unless you're like me & don't really know anything )

 

Fantastic portrait David! That is a coin for which I would gladly "overpay".

 

Great topic for a post and beautiful coin, David! I think that I've paid more than many collectors would have been willing to pay for some of my coins but if the money is going toward keeping one of my favorite dealers in business—I'm okay with giving them a little extra. The joy of owning a hard to find coin makes it all worth it.

 

Very true! Also, the regrets for passing up a desired piece (overpriced or not) will only get worse over time. There are several coins I hope will resurface in trade and allow me a second chance at them, but I fear I am chasing phantoms.

 

That's a beauty @David Atherton!

I agree with that! Unless your dipping into the kids college fund or not getting your bills paid because you picked up a new aureus or something! LOL!

The only coin I have really overpaid on were uncleaned lot coins, pay 20 bucks for 20 turds. At one time I actually enjoyed the cleaning aspect of it however, so maybe it was worth it.