[Poll] BONUS! #8 Cucumbor vs #10 Ancient Aussie - CIT 2017

After so many great coin related showdowns over the past few weeks we have finally come to our final two matches. This match is a fun bonus match that is brought to you by popular demand and features our remaining two final four coiners in a bid to determine who will grab the silver and the bronze medals available in the tournament (the other medals are gold and electrum).

If you still aren’t aware of the tournament (where have you been all month?) and would like to get caught up on the action you can do so at the following link;

https://www.cointalk.com/threads/an...intalk-coin-imperator-tournament-2017.293824/


#8 @Cucumbor



Commodus,
Sestertius- Rome mint, 192 CE
Wt.: 21.01 g
Obv.: L AEL AVREL CO---MM AVG P FEL,Laureate head of Commodus right
Rev.: HERCVLI ROMANO AVG,Hercules facing, head left, holding club and lion's skin, resting on trophy.SCin field
Ref : RCV #5752, Cohen #203

Price: For me: Listening to my grandfathers’ old war stories; For my grandfather: Getting shot at

My grandfather, born 1894, has been "lucky" enough to get involved in the whole WWI where he's been wounded five times (two actual wounds and three gas attacks). While digging a trench at Verdun battle (1916), he eventually found three coins that he carefully kept with him during three years (he's not been sent back home earlier than 1919). After the end of the war, being in a train, back home with two other "poilus" he decided he whould give one coin to each of them and keep the last one for himself (probably one of the first "ancient coin giveaway" in the 20th century). As written above, when I was 18, being the only one in the family showing an interest for coins he told me the story and gifted me with the coin.



Why it’s cool:
It is the very first roman coin I have ever possessed. It's of course the real start of my addiction for ancient coins.

My grand dad finding it during his service and keeping it until the end of the war and for almost his entire life makes it the coin I will keep whatever occurs in my own life and/or to my coin collections.

As for the coin itself, its coolness comes from it being minted the last year in Commodus' rule, in 192 CE, as he'd turn completely crazy finding himself being a reincarnation of Hercules. Even though the obverse doesn't show him with the lionskin, the reverse has an explicit legend and clearly shows the emperor/hercules with Hercules' attributes.

And to finish with, the following comment is taken from the description of a similar example (in far much better condition) in NAC auction 4, # 477 :Few Roman coins excite as much commentary as those of Commodus, which show him possessed of Hercules. Not only do they present an extraordinary image, but they offer incontrovertible support to the literary record. The reports of Commodus’ megalomania and infatuation with Hercules are so alarming and fanciful that if the numismatic record was not there to confirm, modern historians would almost certainly regard the literary record as an absurd version of affairs, much in the way reports of Tiberius’ depraved behaviour on Capri are considered to be callous exaggerations. Faced with such rich and diverse evidence, there can be no question that late in his life Commodus believed that Hercules was his divine patron. Indeed, he worshipped the demigod so intensely that he renamed the month of September after him, and he eventually came to believe himself to be an incarnation of the mythological hero. By tradition, Hercules had fashioned his knotted club from a wild olive tree that he tore from the soil of Mount Helicon and subsequently used to kill the lion of Cithaeron when he was only 18 years old. Probably the most familiar account of his bow and arrows was his shooting of the Stymphalian birds while fulfilling his sixth labour. The reverse inscription HERCVLI ROMANO AVG (‘to the August Roman Hercules’) makes the coin all the more interesting, especially when put into context with those of contemporary coins inscribed HERCVLI COMMODO AVG, which amounts to a dedication ‘to Hercules Commodus Augustus’.


#10 @Ancient Aussie



HADRIAN 117-118 AD, CILICIA-AEGEAE
AR Tridrachm,
Issue Year 164 (ΔΞΡ)
Wt.: 9.6 g
Dia.: 26 mm
Obv. ΑΥΤΟΚΡ ΚΑΙС ΤΡΑΙΑΝΟС ΑΔΡΙΑΝΟС СΕΒ
Laureate head of Hadrian, r., with drapery on l. shoulder
Rev. ΑΙΓΕΑΙΩΝ ΕΤΟΥС ΔΞΡ
Athena standing l., holding in r. hand patera over goat, r. head turned back, l. hand resting on shield; behind, spear
Prieur 714, GIC 1218, Toned Rare.

Price: approx. $500+

Why it’s cool:
The year is 117 AD and the Roman Empire is at its greatest territorial extent. After having annexed Armenia and Mesopotamia, and having experienced dramatic military triumph from 114 AD, Trajan's health started to fail him. He was personally present at the siege of the fortress city of HATRA on the TIGRIS River which continued to hold out against repeated Roman assaults. It is possible that he suffered a heat stroke while in the blazing heat during the siege. On the way back to Rome Trajan died on campaign in CICILIA in 117 AD, with HADRIAN in command of his rear guard.

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It is speculated that Trajan may not have named a successor and that his wife, Plotina (who was fond of Hadrian), signed the papers of succession. Therefore it is thought that she, not the emperor, was responsible for Hadrian's adoption as heir. However that may be, it is known Trajan respected Hadrian and considered him as a possible successor even if he did not officially name him as such. Hadrian's service is well documented through the various important positions he held prior to becoming emperor of Rome. While the details of Hadrian's succession are indeed mysterious, Trajan might well have decided on his deathbed to make Hadrian his heir but the sequence of events does seem suspicious. Trajan died on the 8th August 117 AD, on the 9th it was announced at Antioch that he had adopted Hadrian. However, it was only on the 11th that was it made public that Trajan had died.

According to the historian Dio Cassius Hadrian's accession was solely due to the actions of empress Plotina who kept Trajan's death a secret for several days. In this time she sent letters to the senate declaring Hadrian the new heir. However, these letters carried her own signature, not that of Emperor Trajan, probably using the excuse that the emperor's illness made him too feeble to write.
Yet another rumor asserted that someone had been snuck into Trajan's chamber by the empress, in order to impersonate his voice. Once Hadrian's accession was secure, and only then, did empress Plotina announce Trajan's death.

So how does the above coin tie into all this drama? The interest of this coin is actually twofold:

1) It is somewhat uncommon for Greek provincial coins to be able to be dated to a specific year with any certainty. However this issue is dated with the reverse inscription “ETOYC” (year) “ΔΞΡ” = 117/8 AD. The year and the province of Trajan’s death!
2) The city of Aegeae and the region where this coin was minted did not have a history of continuous silver issues (an activity that was tightly controlled by imperial prerogative). Therefore Hadrian would have to have directly ordered this limited mintage for a specific purpose. This is why the coin is so rare.

Based on the evidence from the province of origin, the date immediately after Trajan’s death and the inclusion of TRAIANOC on the obverse, this coin was issued to immediately dispel any notion with his supporters in the east that Hadrian was not the adoptive son of Trajan. The need for this limited issue is also directly related to Hadrian requiring additional coinage in order to successfully conclude the Second Judean-Roman War in 117 AD. So the coins likely circulated among the eastern legions as well.

It’s also interesting to think that for many people living in the eastern Roman provinces this coin would have been the first tangible evidence of a new emperor after almost two decades of steady leadership under Trajan. The first sight of this coin may have brought about some strong emotions and uncertainty in many.




This will be our second to last match of the tournament and I am glad we are getting to see two more coins from these two great members. Feel free to post whatever you think is relevant. Thank you to all who have participated in the tournament.

 

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Damn, those are two great coins, guys. Whichever way this matchup goes, I'm glad we got to see the coins and read both of your excellent write-ups!

 

That's one great Sestertius @Cucumbor, still with good detail besides legend, and you must be very proud to have grandfather who was so active in the war and survived, stories like this are especially memorable here in Australia today as it is ANZAC day where we lost so many good men at Gallipoli and elsewhere in WW1.

 

To bad I could not vote four times, would of voted for each twice. Wonder write ups, history Etc.

 

Wow @Ancient Aussie ! a tridrachm ! You're not kind with my grand father !
Great coin anyway, well played sir

Q

 

A very well matched battle ...

=> this is gonna be a bloody slugfest!!

 

Gorgeous selections guys! Excellent, excellent match-up! One coin launches an incredible coin collecting career! The other such a cool historical placemarker. Again, I want SIX VOTES! What a match!

 

Mine's got a goat on it, what about it.

 

The goat definitely scored you eye-appeal, my friend .... but I gave Q the nod for the war-story price vote (and I won't tell either of you who received my third vote)

 

super coins and great histories both!

 

Cucumbor - 36
Ancient Aussie - 35

Can it get any closer??

 

A bit too close to my taste

Q

 

Definitely an acquired taste .

Cucumbor - 45
Ancient Aussie - 44

 

Wow these two have been trading a 1 point lead all day... talk about a battle of the titans.

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Hey, I can be bought => if you dudes need a vote, or two!!

... I'm just sayin'

 

Two awesome coins. Interesting enough, what got me into coin collecting was getting my father's coins.

 

Come to think of it...Cucumbor's coin really shouldn't be winning in "value for the money." Think about where it was found and what his grandfather had to do before and after he got it! And I mean this post with nothing but the utmost respect.

 

The cost of risk-of-life is immeasurable.

 

Not sure I can agree on these statements...
Maybe should I hire @Sallent to plead the case

"Come to think" that what my grand father has faced was not related to the coins he had found "per se". Even with no coin in his pocket he would have been in the same damn fricken mess for the five years of WWI.
The case would be different if he'd had to fight against guys wanting to steel the coins from him.

Yes, the cost of risk-of-life is immeasurabale, but to me, there is no extra risk in having found three coins in such conditions. That said, the way he found them, kept one and gave it to me in the end give an infinite value to this sestertius

Sorry if some of you find me over-reactive, I'm a bit emotionnal on the subject
I love you all coin friends

Q

 

Hoorah!

Also I can see why his coin is winning in that catergory, Other then the heroic acts of his grandfather, what did it cost?(Not including blood, sweat and tears...) Nothing, seems to me the right price, no?