Germany to repatriate & audit 150 tones of gold reserves from ny fed!!!

Would not expect anything else. But fortunately it is pretty well documented what the source of the Bundesbank's gold is - namely the profits from the 1950s and 1960s.

Christian

 

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'My Gold, Your Gold... Everyone's Gold!' (Or not. My bet: when you assume it's there, it's probably not.)

The NY Fed Gold has been swapped soooo many times, there's much more on the CB books than in the vaults. Does anyone really doubt that, in the end, it will be cartel bank insiders who 'get the Gold'? It surely won't go to the taxpayers!
http://www.zerohedge.com/contributed/2012-10-23/flash-german-gold-report-reveals-secret-sales-likely-were-part-swaps

 

What I said is very well documented. It's a part of German history.
'
Furthermore in the post previous to this one, in a link that I did not post, I find this quote:

Most of Germany's gold reserves -- some 3,400 tons worth an estimated $190 billion at current rates -- have been kept in the vaults of the U.S. Federal Reserve, the Bank of France, and the Bank of England since the postwar days, when Berlin worried about a possible land war with the Soviet bloc.
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My point is proven.

 

Sure. Maybe you did not see my reply #12 where I mentioned that; goldmark mentioned it too. That point I don't argue about. As for the rest, believe what you want to believe. Some people also claim that there is no gold at Fort Knox, and that Dominique Strauss-Kahn was arrested only because he had learned about that.

Christian

 

There is much to doubt. The article you link to contains words like:
perhaps
secret
suggests
implication
could
somewhat

It's all supposition. And it ends with "If you haven't already considered helping us financially, please do so now:

http://www.gata.org/node/16"

So it's a good story, but not much analysis, and a request for money at the end. The central banks obviously don't want to publicize their transaction in order not to tip off traders as to their methods and actions. It is completely understandable.

 

All I know is the more politicians and governments start to question what is there and what isn't, the more likely actual audits are to take place and more people will pay attention to gold.

 

Well, there's no doubt that when things go wrong, the politicians look for scapegoats to hold up in front of the people in order to deflect attention from themselves. But in the case of gold, it might be a pretty tough sell. Gold hasn't been important to commerce or to individuals for a very long time, and if gold isn't where people think it is, it probably won't even be a headline story for more than a few days.

 

Actually, it ends with a Boston Globe article - which confirms the MSM (The New York Times) is 'joining the conspiracy theorists' LOL Or at least reporting the ever-louder chorus of audit-demanding doubters... isn't "conspiracy theorist" what they called GATA and anyone else ("Gold Bugs") wondering whose Gold is there, unencumbered and duly accounted for?

I wouldn't throw the baby out with the bathwater here - GATA aren't kooks IMO. They've done good investigative work for awhile, and I generally listen to whistleblowers. But even if I caught Max Keyser's revelation back in 2009, I don't know whose Gold is in the Fed vaults now, frankly.

>>While Keiser's documentary does not identify the Bundesbank spokesman who confirmed the transfer of the German gold reserves to New York, it does provide the date and location of the confirmation: March 17, 2008, at Bundesbank headquarters in Frankfurt. The documentary shows that Keiser was there and got the interview.

After his interview at the Bundesbank, Keiser remarks: "The most fascinating thing I've heard is that all the gold in Germany is in New York." <<

The video link is halfway down the page:
http://www.24hgold.com/francais/contributor.aspx?article=2321850632G10020

 

Max Kaiser and GATA are very entertaining but are not always correct. Go back and read some of Kaiser's stuff about Libya. He was there and completely misinterpreted what he saw firsthand. So take it with a grain of salt. But what if the media doesn't know who owns the gold? The Fed does. And if it turns out they are only storing gold for others, what is anyone going to do with that information? It might be interesting, but is is relevant to anything?

 

So that you don't try to hide behind the curtain of being misquoted, I included your entire post and my entire post. I never implied that you said it's happening now. I removed your qualifiers, simply because of lack of relevance.

It doesn't matter when the supposed gold run starts. The reality is that gold ISN'T needed for anything at this point. There are comparable alternatives for all uses of gold, and this would mean a supplanting of gold as a basis of trade, if ever there is a complete breakdown of federal reserve gold holdings. Additionally, gold holdings are political and not economic.

The US dollar is backed by all US holdings, including land. If there is no gold at the Fed, we buy it on the open market or trade swaps. It doesn't matter. If it's delivered, it still doesn't matter. In many ways, the use of gold in bullion is tradition rather than resulting from practicality.

Anyway, the point wasn't that REMG or PMG elements would be used specifically, but more so that something would replace gold. Look at petroleum. For decades we've known about proven nat gas reserves in the US, but no one cared until we hit peak oil. And because the auto industry had excess petrol driven supply, we still used/subsidized oil well into peak oil (six years now?). Anyway, it's likely that the governments have been discussing a new bullion metal (platinum / palladium) for use in reserve coinage. We don't know, and, for the most part, it won't affect us.

 

Au contraire: when the last train leaves Paris, I want to be seated aboard. Who doesn't?

No. It doesn't matter you think this; thousands of Indians and Chinese "investors" (and a not small of collectors number here) obviously prove otherwise. Likewise, World Bank Pres. Robert Zoellick concurs with the markets (aka real investors): "The system should also consider employing gold as an international reference point of market expectations about inflation, deflation and future currency values. Although textbooks may view gold as the old money, markets are using gold as an alternative monetary asset today."

I know why Paper Bugs hate Gold so - it debunks their nonsense.

Now, now. That's accusatory and unnecessarily hostile - please stick to the terms of use, thx.

As a portfolio allocation, I favor/believe in PGMs (and Gold & Silver) because I doubt Paper. For the prudent man, it's not an all-or-nothing but rather hedge-your-bets-wisely call.
If you can only grasp PGM "investments" (and not Gold bullion 'ever') then invest in certain miner shares and/or the PGM ETFs exclusively.

 

I remember his oh-so-exciting revelation about three years ago. Even Krause's Numismaster published a story about that, written by Patrick A. Heller in August 2009. Heller expected an "outcry" in Germany, as he wrote. What, just because a few people in the US cannot get their facts straight?

It has been known for many years that the Bundesbank stores its gold at various locations. In 2004, for example - more than five years before Keiser and Heller "revealed" what they believed was not known - there was a debate in Germany about selling a considerable part of the gold. (Did ultimately not happen by the way.) Pretty much every article about this mentioned that much or most of the gold was in New York. The precise figures have, for "security reasons", not been public until now*. That may have been a mistake which fueled some rumors.

(* About 45% of the gold is in New York/Fed, 13% in London/BoE, 11% in Paris/BdF. The rest, about 31%, is in Germany.)

Christian

 

My take-away from the Keiser "revelation" was that the NY Fed's Gold isn't the cartel banks, nor the Fed's nor the US Treasury's ... it's Germany's. Or rather, because of an implicit accounting fraud (SWAPS) several parties now have claim to the very same Gold. And I thought this (the SWAPS) is part of the reason why Rep. Ron Paul keeps calling for an audit of the US Fed/Treasury Gold. Is that unclear, why?

I never got the impression (in 2009) that Keiser was enraged the Bundesbank was storing its Gold in NYC, but maybe you read differently.

I have no idea what "good reason" they have for not fully auditing and revealing #s for US Treasury Gold. But I'll be the first to admit I haven't been following this issue closely. Where's the most recent detailed & complete US audit of US govt-owned Gold, please?

 

My point was proven. You called it a "weird theory" yet now you acknowledge, begrudgingly that it isn't. There isn't anything else to be said about it.

Fort Knox has nothing to do with this.

 

The Federal Reserve does not claim any of this gold.

The gold on the Federal Reserve's balance sheet is in the form of Gold Certificates issued by the US Government. It is backed by the gold in Ft. Knox and other US depository locations as controlled by the US Treasury. The gold in the NY Fed's basement has nothing to do with this and it's not on the Fed's balance sheet.

It was handled in this manner should the day ever come where Congress decides to dismantle the Federal Reserve.

 

I'll go out on a limb here.

IF Germany's audit/recall of Bundesbank Gold (held abroad) causes 'a bank run' on global Gold reserves, THEN Au would go parabolic AND the US would soon 'confiscate' GLD's massive holdings in London by Executive Fiat. Thereafter, the Gold Price would be systematically tanked by Anglo-American interests, as in the 1980s. But I do wonder if that routine would work, again.

I really don't see this happening/starting in 2013, however. (And Gold-hoarding sheeple need not fear for their tiny stashes either.) Other factors will be 'bigger deals.'

 

It's a very long limb that you have gone out on.

First, don't expect there ever to be an audit that means anything and if there is, they will never admit that gold is gone. First even doing the audit would commit a cardinal sin of Central Banksters. That sin is to admit that gold has some role to play in the world financial system. While they value gold, they don't want the "great unwashed" to believe in it. Second, if some rogue politician manages to force an audit, it will consist of a token audit that is pretty much meaningless.

 

Apologies for my imprecision, fatima: are we certain the member banks aren't title to (swapped for) any of that Gold? o.k. then.

"Inside, a massive scale is ringed by 122 blue cages that hold about 530,000 gold bars — 34,021 of which belong to Uncle Sam."
http://articles.latimes.com/2012/aug/02/business/la-fi-gold-bars-20120803

The US Treasury's unencumbered, or even more pledged to the IMF? Call me a conspiracy theorist, but 'should the day ever come' I imagine those bars - and not just 3-5% the overall reserves - won't be there at all. (I think THAT's Ron Paul's point, too.)

 

Nah, guess that Keiser just did not know that a large portion of the Bundesbank gold (certainly not "all" of it ...) was in new York. So for him - he published that video report in March 2008 - it may well have been news. What I just found amusing: In mid-2004 several papers/new sites had articles about the gold and where it is; as I mentioned, there had been plans to sell part of it. Here is one (in German) from stern.de for example. OK, so Keiser had no idea until four years later - no big deal, this was just a small portion of the report anyway, basically a side note.

A year later, Heller (in Numismaster) gets back to the story. Seems he did not know either that part of the gold has been in New York, so he writes "In the past, the Bundesbank has denied that German gold reserves were in the custody of the United States. To now reveal the truth may well cause a great controversy in German political circles." (Source) Umm, writing about something that has been known for a while is not exactly what I call a revelation.

Christian

 

The article is 100% in agreement with what I said. Your article says the gold of the US Treasury. I said Federal Reserve. You re-quoted it yourself.

Furthermore the article states where US gold is stored and by elimination, less than 5% of this gold would be at the NY Fed.