First bullion buy (Panda)

Hi Folks,

I bought my first bullion yesterday, three silver Pandas (2011) from supplier and three from another. I usually buy numismatics but looking to diversify. I paid £28.93 each form one supplier which is about 47 bucks. I anyone knows how someoune in the UK might do better please let me know as looking to get another thirty shortly.

Thanks.....marbury518

 

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That is amazingly good value in the UK! There are some real rip-off stores where they could cost between £59.95 and £69.95. e.g. http://www.londonmintoffice.org/

The cheapest place I know in Europe is : http://vatea.de/xtcommerce/index.php

Not only is it in the EU, but VAT is only 7%, so completely legal to buy and import, since the VAT is already paid in a member state. Even Switzerland charges 8%.

For some strange reason, Germany has 7% VAT on silver coins, but 19% on silver bars.

Makes it quite interesting to compare the price of 1kilo bars with 1 kilo coins!

Steve

 

Just be extremely cautious when buying Pandas. They are one of the most commonly counterfeited pieces of bullion in the world. Only buy them from reputable sources and make sure they offer a return policy just in case the coins they send you look suspicious. I only have one silver Panda in my collection and I purchased it several years ago from Apmex which is a very reputable company for stuff like this.

 

Thanks for both replies. I got three from Bullion By Post (93 Vyse Street, Hockley, Birmingham, B18 6JZ) which seems a big dealership. The other three I got from e-bay shop Numis-World.....
they have excellent feedback. When I asked for anymore they said they couldn't help, so a good sign I guess. They purchased direct from the mint, though I did query their mintage description
at 600,000 which even I know to be inaccurate (3m) for 2011. I'm also aware to look out for less than sharp calligraphy.............have seen pandas offered from China at rock bottom prices and no customer
feedback.....$6 each or something crazy. Saw one US dealer offering really good prices too but when I got to final check-out it said you can't buy from us unless your order is at least $1500! I'm
bidding on the big Chinese numismatic auction on 26th of this month which you can all access from Sixbid. Determined to get some high end stuff so that will clean me out for a while....all the best...J

 

I wouldn't buy any Chinese silver or gold on ebay, so many fakes!

 

I agree with the other posters but forgot to mention it in my reply.

Just do a search for Panda fakes, ASE fakes etc.

I too only have one Panda. The others are all ASE's, Kooks, Koalas, Maples, old crowns etc. Still haven't got a Britannia.

Apparently the fakes are very difficult to spot. I'm lucky in that I work in a place with high precision balances so I'm able to weigh the coins.

I may be wrong (correct me if I am) but I think it's almost impossible to fake the characteristic ring you hear when you balance a silver coin on the tip of your finger and tap it with something metallic... e.g. another coin. The sound is very much like a tuning fork, whereas a fake coin will just give a dull 'clunk' sound.

There are plenty of articles and Youtube videos about this.

Good luck,

Steve

 

How about a picture of your new Pandas? I have two myself, and would like to have one of every one so far! They are so pretty..
Lucy

 

first bullion buy

Thanks for the advice, though warnings about Fakes are out there load and clear. I understand that clinking them together ain't a great idea as they tend to be vacuum wrapped from the mint,
though a good test is to look for the diagonal reeding which the fakers have trouble with apparently (post 2000). Also I read that the comparison between the black and white fur just isn't like
the authentic ones with an eye glass.

I also picked up a 2001 D Mint mark, vacuum wrapped, mint embossed down sides, boxed with for a good price from e-bay. 58 bucks.

If they come back fakes you guys can tell me when I post them and some will say 'I told you so!' We'll wait and see. For the e-bay critics rest assured I won't buy in
any volume from e-bay, but just test the waters with these small buys and always do it through paypal.


I did buy a Secundo Crown 1821 in AU or close MS for $599 on e-bay and after having it appraised by Heritage Dallas they asserted the market value was $2,000.............
maybe that's why I never made much money selling on e-bay either.

 

Panda do go up very well in $$$
but only buy Graded or from Panda USA.

 

I bought a fake gold 1oz Panda from China (eBay). The coin they used in the pic was real but they sent me a coin with a different date and denomination, and I could tell it was fake even though I was sealed in plastic. I took me 3 months to get paypal to give me my money back as they could care less about people shipping counterfeit coins. The same seller did this to another person also. Just thought I'd share so others may learn.

 

What country was it from Stevie and did they have excellent feedback and plenty of it?

I took a risk buying from Slovenia but they had excellent feedback from all over the world and they keep in regular contact...great comms and just confimed the diagonal reeding.....once I explained what it was of course.

Sorry to hear your horror story and troubled to hear paypal were less than helpful.

Regards...J

 

I believe that even the fakes have become collectible now! They have numistatic value depending on the quality of the fake.

There is no reason for us to collect Pandas. There are plenty of other coins out there with much lower premiums. I've never understood why Pandas, with their sordid history of chinese fakes, should command such premiums.

Is it really worth it?


Steve

 

I have 1 1/10 oz gold Panda that i got off ebay US seller and it is real. The fake I bought was from China from a seller with only 1 feedback. But if you think I'm stupid, the dummy that left them the 1st positive feedback did so before even getting his Panda in the mail. I know that was a mistake but I figured I was protected with paypal so what the hell. Well learned the hard way you are not fully protected like they always say. I took 3 months of battling them to can my money back. It will be the last Panda I will ever buy but that's ok since Eagles, rounds and Maples are much cheaper.

 

Just got my first Panda through the door this morning, the day after buying it. It was boxed, and double sealed and it is the D mint mark 2001 which I think
is only 33k population intended for domestic market. Considering this was a similar price to a run of the mill 2011 I clearly did well on this e-bay transaction.
Not a perfect specimen as there looks to be some contact marks under the date close to rim which follow the shape of the coin......only see it with
a glass though, still pretty happy.

 

I've bought all my Pandas from dealers in the US. The 2 I use most ofen are Panda America and Mint Products. Both are good companies and I've never had any major issues with either of them. The prices are not too bad and sometimes when I've gone to a local show Panda America will offer the coins at a lower cost

 

As I live in the UK i guess the postage would be prohibitive and shows are out of the question here (the time, the travel) for me anyway.........just another tonight....2008 1oz silver Panda Fabulous 12 collection presentation capsule....j

 

Just won the the fat man at auction in Spain.....1920 Chinese Silver dolar (yr9) EBC which equates to extremley fine in UK grades for 140 euro.......reasonable in these
heady days of chinese sales...........j

 

Not so much the postage, but the import taxes! I don't know about the UK, but here in Italy, the post office has tightened up considerably in the last few years.

There was a time when I was buying stuff from the USA without any problem. The P.O. just didn't bother. These days, it's very different. With the tax and the P.O. fee, it's not worth it.

I think the threshold for VAT in the UK is about 18 pounds. So if silver falls below this, you could buy single coins from Guernsey, USA etc with no additional tax to pay.

Steve

 

import duties

Yea....I got absolutely stung buying from Heritage as they plaster the value all over the package! I bought 4 $2 Newfoundland gold toonies in AU for $1700 as had to pay a big fee at the post office.........not sure I should name them but another similar auction house in the states BM appear less candid about values so help us us collectors.........cheers..julain

 

That is a good point because I would think that the premium for Pandas silver coins would go down if there are a lot of fakes out there.