Counterfeit Morgan? Double struck, rotated obverse

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by No_Ragrets, Sep 17, 2026 at 9:45 AM.

  1. No_Ragrets

    No_Ragrets Self-proclaimed Semi-Amateur Numismatist Supporter

    I'm fairly sure this is not legit, but I wanted to get more eyes on it before I return it to its owner. 1887 (P) Morgan, double struck, seemingly only on one side which is also rotated. This by itself boggles my mind on how something like that could happen. It's also off in weight slightly at 26.275 grams.

    I've not been able to identify any VAM on it, but it's admittedly difficult on worn down coins. The owner checked it with his Sigma and said it registered as 90% silver, so at least it's got that going for it. But for everything else, it just seems off. With such a clear rotation on the obverse, one would imagine a similar rotation on the reverse, which is only showing mild distortion of some of the devices at best.

    So, what are your thoughts on this one? I'll see if I can get more pictures uploaded since I've got my new laptop, but I'm finding I have a different version of Paint now that doesn't seem to want to let me reduce pixel size and still keep the whole image. For now, these are just pictures of my scope screen and a couple of cropped screenshots. Thanks!

    Screenshot (4).png Screenshot (5).png 20260911_161813.jpg 20260911_161746.jpg 20260911_160947.jpg 20260911_160917.jpg 20260911_160738.jpg 20260911_160725.jpg 20260911_160720.jpg 20260911_160633.jpg
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2026 at 12:58 PM
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  3. Mr. Numismatist

    Mr. Numismatist Strawberry Token Enthusiast

    Looks off, but I can't find anything definitive yet. I don't like the pit on the rim near the second star. Are the lowest parts of the hair and the inner part of the ear level with the fields? Often the computerized counterfeiting die machines don't get the relief quite right.
     
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  4. KBBPLL

    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

    It looks like the first strike was a different date? That last digit is not a 7; looks like a 0 to me. Seems fishy.

    Screenshot (4)_edit.jpg
     
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  5. Mr.Q

    Mr.Q Well-Known Member

    When in doubt let your conscience be your guide. Wear and tear would bring the weight done but I don't believe it would bring it down to 275 and still have such clarity, just my opinion. Good luck.
     
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  6. fretboard

    fretboard Defender of Old Coinage!

    Terrible looking coin, looks casted I would send it back asap!
     
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  7. No_Ragrets

    No_Ragrets Self-proclaimed Semi-Amateur Numismatist Supporter

    I'm not sure how to physically verify that, but they seem like the typical depth. I tried looking at the hair D, eye, inner ear, inside the bow loop... couldn't get any kind of hint as to a VAM.
     
  8. No_Ragrets

    No_Ragrets Self-proclaimed Semi-Amateur Numismatist Supporter

    I didn't purchase this, it's just on loan to me from the owner to see if I could find markers for any VAM. Alas, I've hit a wall.

    And yeah, it just doesn't feel right. Something about it seems off, especially after giving her the old microscope look.
     
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  9. Mr.Q

    Mr.Q Well-Known Member

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  10. No_Ragrets

    No_Ragrets Self-proclaimed Semi-Amateur Numismatist Supporter

    Yeah, weight is 26.275g. I've had some Morgans in that territory before but they were worn down a heck of a lot more than this one.
     
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