Not really, almost all the 5 figure coins where it makes a massive difference have been there already and I would bet a majority of four figure ones have too that come to market. The lack of a sticker rate isn't because of a lack of submissions they just only like certain things. Common things where it doesn't matter a lot may blow up in the population if everything was sent, but it wasn't that important on those in the first place. Just as an example the Pogue coins are snickering around 50 percent and that is certainly an amazing collecting.
You don't need to look at a sticker to tell you whether a coin already graded is accurately graded or not. All you need to do is look at the coin! If someone who already owns the coin wants to pay for another opinion on top of the one already given than fine, it's their money to do whatever they choose to do with it. I would agree that if it helps them sleep better than they should go for it. I'm just one that doesn't believe a coin should be valued more because the seller paid for a 2nd opinion. As I previously stated, the real benefit is to the seller since there are plenty of buyers willing to pay for the sticker. Whether it's a majority of buyers or not I don't know, but there a lot of them. That's obvious given how big CAC has gotten. Aside from the increase in a coins sale price, the other huge benefit is that a dealer doesn't have to crack out the coin from its slab to get it to sell for the price of a higher grade. That's the only reason CAC stickers exist.
So for the clueless newbies among us (me!), if I understand this correctly I can send my coin to PCGS to be graded, and then if I send it to CAC they will put a sticker on it if they agree with the PCGS grade? Is that correct?
In theory they sticker a slab if it's determined that the grade given by the TPG is a "solid" example for that grade. In other words, even within a specified grade coins can vary, and they sticker the better examples within that grade. There's no end to the business opportunities if people are willing to pony up. Personally, I think it's nonsense...but I'm usually wrong...LOL.
I thought there's two stickers, a green and gold one. If it's solid for grade, green, then I'd assume they might resend for next grade, especially if there's such a thing over several years called gradeflation. Personally, I can't afford most CAC snickered coins so I don't worry about it much. But if I did run into it a lot, I'd probably be indifferent leaning towards dislike. I trust the TPGs got it accurate the first time and I like being able to judge myself whether the grade is warranted. What you say is correct, that the sticker helps sellers, so it almost seems bad for buyers who are always looking for a good deal
"So for the clueless newbies among us (me!), if I understand this correctly I can send my coin to PCGS to be graded, and then if I send it to CAC they will put a sticker on it if they agree with the PCGS grade? Is that correct?" What I've seen them explain is; they sticker coins that are A or B coins for the grade - not "C" coins. It should be pretty obvious that there are a range of coins that can be any particular grade - including those that just make the grade and those that just miss the next grade - so, CAC supposedly assesses the status of the coin within the grade and gives it a sticker if it's mid grade or high for the grade. It seems like they also put a premium on coins that have original surfaces. I have learned a lot from studying those that they have accepted and those they haven't. The difference isn't always clear to me, but then, it often is (clear).
Since CAC will buy basically anything they sticker in it's simplest form the Green sticker is a coin they would want to buy. In my experience the "solid" for the grade are kind of hit or miss if they sticker, they have to have the right look. Generally IMO (other's experience may vary) eye appeal and/or original are king with them over pure technical grading. There are. Gold is for coins they say are undergraded. No one is sure of what the exact requirements are but most feel that for a gold it would have to be something they would at least sticker at the next grade up. Needless to say they don't hand those out often.
Yes, I am a CAC dealer. It's $12.50 per coin whether it stickers or not. In my time, I've gotten 4 golds. My percentage of stickered coins is right around the average... 60% or so.
Cool. Please don't take my comments on CAC as something negative towards sellers. I think if it's good for business without being unethical then it's only logical to sell CAC stickered coins. You have to give the people what they want, right? All I'm saying is when I go to purchase I try to stay away from coins that have a premium for the sticker, which is just about all of them. Moving on... I don't know how long or how many times you have submitted to CAC but if you (as well as other dealers) have been dealing with CAC for a long time, shouldn't there be a good idea which coins will get stickered beforehand? How come the average then stays at 60%? I would imagine someone that has received hundreds (or thousands) of stickered coins should have a good idea what look gets a sticker, right? Could it be CAC intentionally keeps the average among all the coins worthy of getting a sticker capped at 60%?
Wow! That's all? And to think in all these years of watching idiots, unable to grade to save their own lives, dumping money down toilet, and all they needed to do was look at the damn coin. Go figure... Remember what I said, and you so quickly dismissed, about the "educational" experience? If he's actually a dealer, or even a collector member, and gets some time under his belt, unless he's gambling, his hit rate will go up... it's a learning experience. It was the same with me and would be the same for you if you received privileges and started submitting. And no.... they're not artificially keeping submissions capped at a 60% approval.
That's really built on a false pretense, if they deemed it worthy it would sticker so really the worthy coins have a 100 percent rate. Plus they make their money buying and selling their coins, I doubt they make much if anything off the 12.50 sticker fee when you consider salaries. Why would they want to limit what they know they would want to sell
I have sent in 2 orders where they all stickered. I've only been a CAC dealer for a couple months, but I'm learning what he's looking for. Still, there have been a few that I can find no reason why they failed to pass. I need to call him up and pick his brain. As far as pricing... I've found that people don't pay much of a premium for CAC coins that are run-of-the-mill, like MS64 Morgans. But for top pops and better coins, the stickered coins can go for thousands more. Look at price history for 1885-CC Morgans on Heritage in MS67. There are only a few. But the CAC stickered one sold for something around $13k, and non stickered ones go for $8-10k. Forgive my numbers not being exact. I am typing this on my phone, eating Frosted Flakes with a banana, and watching HLN at 6:04 a.m.
I have a CAC account. Without a doubt, Mr. Albanese is running a class outfit. In a few words he will explain why a coin didn't sticker. From those, I have learned a ton. Usually, my gold sticker candidates were denied even a green sticker. Mostly for subtle issues that I never even saw. In other words, a coin that was silently net graded by the TPG. In order to get a gold sticker, a coin needs to be virtually an A+ coin for the next grade up.
A few months ago I asked CAC about new memberships. They sent me an application packet that I need to fill out, but I noticed it said something about numismatic references. How exactly does that work- do I need CAC dealers to vouch for me or what?
Pretty much any dealer or CAC member works I believe. I believe that part is more imortant for dealer memberships than collector ones.
If you do a little research on the CAC population you'll see that the number of coins that have CAC stickers is far, far below 60% of those that are graded. It might be that high for submitters because they have already made a determination that the coin might CAC, or they wouldn't bother. My rate of success was higher than 60% for a couple of years but I've not had much success lately so my overall average has dropped quite a lot. It also seems to be much harder to get a sticker on older coins and nearly impossible among certain populations because there are so few PQ coins among the survivors. A good example is the 1840 Liberty Seated Dollar. Supposedly 2000 exist and the graded populations between PCGS and NGC is something around 500 or so. The CAC population? 45 - That's less than 10% of the graded population. You'd have to figure that only a minority have been sent in for CAC assessment, but dealers and collectors who happen to have really nice examples would be likely to send them in for assessment disproportionally (i.e., more often than they would send less attractive examples).
