2012 Silver Eagle San Francisco Proof Set "PRICE WATCH"

just realized this is for 5 sets. its up to $610. 122 per set as of now

 

Log in or Sign up to hide this ad.

I would rather bid-out a ms69 1/10th ounce gold eagle at $184 to $189 than pay $150 for this set. Many folks will over-buy hoping to cash in and in the end might end up cutting prices just to re-coup there money. You just can't beat the big guys buying thousands of sets and having them graded. Heck why pay $154 for a set from the mint when you may be able to get 1 on an ebay auction graded PF69 ~ REVERSE PF69 for $179 to $187. We will have to wait and see what the mintages are, I would guess they will be quite high. Just my opinion !

 

"This listing was ended by the seller because the item is no longer available." How does that work with a pre-sale auction. :rollling:

My guess is the bidding wasn't getting up high enough where there was no risk in it for him and he didn't want to lose his shorts...

Considering it isn't going to be hard to get one of these, or even five of these, the only way I'd bid on one is if it was cheaper than I could get it from the mint. So then, I got to thinking. Maybe there are people outside the US who would be willing to pay a premium for them on FeeBay since they might not be able to order them from the mint.

From the auction:

Ships to: US and Canada

This auction was destined for failure.

 

Thanks for your hard work but there's likely a much simpler answer to the pricing. It's the 75th anniversary, there are two coins, marketing guru-think = $75 per coin, less the obligatory .05¢ to arrive at $149.95.

 

I agree that there are many other viable options of what we might buy with the same money. What occurred to me for comparison was to see how much bullion of the same coin one might acquire. Putting aside the argument of numismatic vs. bullion matters for a moment, here's an example I looked at:

Were orders of the 2012 SF ASE two-coin sets, set at 5 per house like the A25 sets were, I could hardly fathom dropping $749.75 on 10 oz of silver! For the same money, as of this writing, one could buy 2012 bullion ASE from Provident Metals at $31.60/coin and have nearly 24 oz. of silver, more than double the ounces one acquires in the numismatic versions at this cost.

 

What do those boys charge for shipping? Gotta figure that into the bottom line......

 

Not that much that it impacts the price differential we are talking about here in any significant manner. Mind you they ship with a normal system as well, none of this FedEx smartpost hand off to the local USPS sort nonsense that leaves things in limbo tracking wise for some of us. The bullion dealers also securely pack and seal parcels, unlike Pitney Bowes (PBGS) who tosses your elegant OGP into a cardboard container with some half crushed coarse brown paper with lots of wiggle room and a crumpled receipt.

 

Yep, morons is right! I guess some people don't know how to order for themselves from the US Mint, or they don't know how to get money out of their Paypal account so they're stuck buying on ebay. Idiots!!

 

Well you don't have to deal with the mint. You can buy it now for $189 + $4.95 S&H.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2012-Americ...14?pt=Coins_US_Individual&hash=item3a756d636a

 

Then why was the 25th anniversary set priced at $299.95? I think they are just trying to maximize profit. A few people likely sat down and wondered what was the maximum price they could charge and still sell them off in quantity. TC

 

I agree. Same thing can be said for buying bullion versus collector pucks. If you save $50 on every purchase by buying the bullion puck, that money can be spent to acquire more PMs. TC

 

The US Mint have been maximizing profit for a very long time already. They've got that act in a can. It doesn't take much effort to bump up price points, especially on known and established popular coin series, to maintain their regular influx of profitability. Only this time they have done so, increased prices, for two coins coming out on the heels of similar quality annual coins priced and selling for less per coin while silver prices too have been in decline from recent past issues of these coins. Let's look at some prices and compare...

The 2010 Proof ASE sold for $45.95, the 2011 Proof ASE sold for $59.95 and the 2011 UNC W, initially, sold for $60.45, all rising while silver prices were at high levels over the last couple years. We might say that was understandable even if it were approaching twice or greater the cost for a numismatic version than it's bullion cousins were then selling for.

The A25 set held at $60 per coin for the $299.95 asking price, but silver prices had already begun to level off a bit by then too. This year, the 2012 proof ASE, that was recently released, sells for $59.95 (again) while it's 2011 W UNC cousin remains on sale, as of this writing, at the reduced price of $45.95. That's a coin sold at a reduced price after its initial offering of $60.45 per coin last year when it became available. Why is the 2012 Proof not less and what will the 2012 W UNC list for remains to be seen, but market spot price for silver, in advance of this SF 75th anniversary ASE product release has decreased a fair amount, yet the price per coin in this set has increased, yet again this year, rather than remaining at $60 per coin like the 2012 Proof has done with the slow down in silver spot price.

The SF 75th anniversary ASE coins are also using similar design and packaging that the A25 set used. Very little additional expenditure has gone into design (probably only in reconfiguration), assembly procedures, investigation and testing of materials required for the OGP and materials acquired for the two-coin set from what was used for the 5-coin set. Many have complained about the Mint's offerings being accessible after the last couple of years 'cancelled orders' or being shut out by high household limits, poor ordering systems and such problems. Whether they have addressed these concerns effectively also remains to be seen for what the new products are listed for sale. Have improvements to customer service and satisfaction taken place and are they worth the new prices, we shall see...

Now the US Mint offers access where some were shut our from the A25 for example (which may prove a very high mintage / sales record for the Mint) but at a significant premium for this very popular product beyond what the Mint has asked for similar products in the past let alone currently charges for similar products. Their profit potential on this latest "special" set is substantial! It's asking $15 more per coin than the current Proof at $60 when spot metal price is less than half $60, somewhere now in the low $28 range / ounce.

These irrational price increases appear more as padding to maintain that progression of profit year after year on numismatic issues, which the Mint cannot maintain while the materials intrinsic costs, it's market value decreases faster than production and labor costs increase. Add to that the Mint's recent barrage of media informing us of robotic coin handling and packaging, quality checking scans instead of the human eye spotting spots, all this eliminating jobs that people were paid to do, and now at less costs than human labor. The prices though increase. The Mint has a long way to go to correct its systems and provide the quality they claim to offer customers if they insist on annual price increases and marketed coin gimmicks to keep collectors addicted to their product in this manner.

I'm not stating emphatically that I wouldn't buy this new product as it is something appealing to me a collector of this series since the first year the series was issued, but I am stating the rational in how prices are arrived at for this product has become absurd, more so in the last few years, and the mere idea that they thought $75 per coin was acceptable on a set of coins celebrating a cities 75th anniversary for bridges and institutions was within range of previous product increases, doesn't seem beyond the realm of improbable in this case.

I am stating that we are aware as collectors when are being played and that we are aware that falling intrinsic value does not see products likewise fairly adjusted lower as have the other similar products been adjusted. Other products bearing precious metals are adjusted and why not this member of the greater Eagle series of coins. Why this is an exception given the lack of originality in the offering, a manufactured collectible, isn't something that will maintain the series' collectors, inspire opportunist like flippers of A25 sets and maintain the merit of the Mint overall in this generation of it's existence.

 

Krispy, I share many of the same sentiments as you. A key point, though, is we have the ability to modify the behavior of the Mint, if we so choose. Just as we can vote a politician out of office, we can choose not to purchase these products. Is that going to happen? Not likely.

Jaws can be jacked and sabers can be rattled, but it is action that will make a difference. I'm afraid our destiny is to continue to be the Mint's playtoys.

 

i guess the thing to do is not buy!
i gave up on quarters, i gave up on JFK 1/2$, i gave up on pres$,and gave up on silver proof year sets, maybe its time to forget ASE's

 

We certainly do have the ability to refuse to buy from the Mint under these terms and not to stand for the poor quality product and customer service. My actions to date have been to respond to all marketing surveys in full, return unacceptable merchandise with written descriptions and photos of the problems that I found to be inferior or flawed products that I have received, to remove all prior product subscriptions I once maintained and scrutinize each item that comes along if I have interest in it. The ASE is the last product that I currently buy direct from the Mint. I have sold the vast majority of my past 'collectible' mint products over the last few years, even things purchased in only the last 5-6 years as I am that dissatisfied with owning such modern pieces that bear decreasing craftsmanship and hands on care. The last couple of years antics and poor customer satisfaction, both for me and my fellow collectors' dissatisfaction, have helped me draw the line from dealing with the Mint. I have this one product that interests me and that is fast drawing to a close. I haven't totally opted out of this 75th set yet, it's not beyond my buying budget at all, but it doesn't make me happy nor confident in my purchase to see arbitrary pricing that is not reflective of the market prices and other product offerings they make available.

Additionally, I have written to my State Senators and Representatives to carry my messages to the appropriate offices in Washington to address a number of problems related to the Mint. I have addressed issues like dropping the ball in 2009 with silver proof eagles not being offered, regarding the ordering and product quality issues, to leaving the Directors position vacant. There is only so much one person can do. Collectors and the institutions that support the hobby need also to aire more than forum greivances. I have utilized forum discusssions and voiced often about the failings of the Mint, and I am increasingly spending less money with the Mint due to these combined problems and overall dissatisfaction. My interest in this one last product that I still wish to collect is quickly eroding for reasons cited. Even if I cease all customer relation with the Mint, my single action won't act to improve the problems we collectors tend to raise. The Mint repeatedly states it is working to improve all the above, but little seems to address the problems, instead initating new systems in which new flaws arise. The Mint does well in profiting and they have that right to do so, as well as raise rates or cease sales due to materials and labor costs rising or falling too low, but there doesn't appear much logic, nor transparency, in what we see as an end result, which means there isn't much logic in collecting their wares at some point either.

 

Sounds like you went through much the same thing I have as I withdrew from various series and sets. I wonder how many collectors are doing the same. I suspect those of us doing this are not just doing it because we have stressed or limited budgets, but rather the other reasons of fatigue dealing with the Mint and the way they operate, price and release things. I certainly have been looking to other numismatic collecting interests and minding the Mint much less in recent years. My spending is about level, just not with the US Mint.

 

https://catalog.usmint.gov/webapp/w...10001&identifier=9100&storeId=10001&langId=-1

price now showing

 

Yes, it is probably the reason for $75/coin price but I bet they paid some marketing a lot of money to come up with it.

 

So who's gonna be 'hovering' on the site at 12PM?

 

Click that link again. It has a BIN of $209.00 :rollling: