COUNTERFEIT .999 Silver Prospectors Warning!

Discussion in 'Bullion Investing' started by LostDutchman, Mar 20, 2012.

  1. LostDutchman

    LostDutchman Under Staffed & Overly Motivated Supporter

    Hey gang!

    One of my friends who owns several coin shops in Ohio stopped by on Saturday and showed me this round. This round and many others fooled another Ohio coin dealer for the sum of around $25,000. He was showing it to me to show what's been circulating and I asked to photograph it and pass it on to you guys.

    A few things can save you from these... but I'm sure the counterfeiters have caught on by now. Firstly Englehard prospectors DON'T come with a "proof" finish. They should all be satin UNC. Secondly the coin weighs .98 Ozt. They all came in the plastic capsule shown. Don't mind the finger prints... Several dealers had looked at it in and out of the capsule before it got to me.

    fake9.jpg
    fake1.jpg fake2.jpg
    fake3.jpg fake4.jpg
     
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  3. LostDutchman

    LostDutchman Under Staffed & Overly Motivated Supporter

  4. Cazkaboom

    Cazkaboom One for all, all for me.

    Scary what people are doing nowadays for a quick buck. Has there been a metallurgy test on it?
     
  5. LostDutchman

    LostDutchman Under Staffed & Overly Motivated Supporter

    Not yet... but he is going to take it to another dealer who is going to hit it with the mass spectrometer and I'll find out then.
     
  6. KoinJester

    KoinJester Well-Known Member

    Matt unless it's your pictures the 999 looks to be a different type set also. From what I could see on the ebay pictures as mine are locked up at home I cannot access them to tell.
     
  7. thedabbler

    thedabbler Member

    Interesting.

    These fakes look like a different variation than the fakes that were being warned about in December.

    The difference between the real and fake prospector then was the right hand.

    Real (1985 - I'm assuming they didn't change the design): http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&_trksid=p4340.l2557&hash=item3cbd670196&item=260875682198&nma=true&pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&rt=nc&si=ZtKhfEsWA6Bj%2B7CXVMWMRrnXkbM%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc

    Fake: http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&_trksid=p4340.l2557&hash=item20bfb8251f&item=140655469855&nma=true&pt=Coins_US_Individual&rt=nc&si=ZtKhfEsWA6Bj%2B7CXVMWMRrnXkbM%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc

    A different kind of fake: http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAP...fEsWA6Bj+7CXVMWMRrnXkbM=&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc

    On yours, the right hand is still different (no thumb holding the pan) and, if I'm counting properly, five fingers of the left hand are visible. No thumbs?
     
  8. jjack

    jjack Captain Obvious

    It says it is "5 PACK OF ENGELHARD COINS .999 FINE LAYERED SILVER " was that ever issued by Englehard?

    As for metallurgy of the fakes it is likely a tin copper alloy which if done right should mimic the weight and dimension of silver.
     
  9. silverfool

    silverfool Active Member

    the hands on the fake are a good tell. it's funny when you compare to a real one.
     
  10. Yacorie

    Yacorie Junior Member

    These kinds of things bother me because I would be one of the people that would fall for this. When I buy silver bars and rounds - i usually just make sure that their JM or Engel. I would have never considered that the 1oz engel round that I was buying could be a fake. There have been times when I've purchased silver rounds/bars from private individuals - trusted folks - but not a dealer. Now I'm going to have to think twice about that kind of thing.
     
  11. Cloudsweeper99

    Cloudsweeper99 Treasure Hunter

    Thanks for the warning.
     
  12. james m. wolfe

    james m. wolfe New Member

    :eek: wow!!! thanks for the warning :yes:
     
  13. medoraman

    medoraman Supporter! Supporter

    I have been waiting for this. The chinese have faked a lot of coins, I was just wondering how long it would be that they faked silver rounds or other bullion. To me they could be easier to pass off to buyers since many buyers are not coin collectors, and don't pay that much attention to bullion, just count it.

    Just wait until they get the dies correct, and start cranking out correct weight issues. :(

    Thanks a lot for the warning Matt.
     
  14. I am happy to report that my silver prospector rounds look nothing like these and are not fakes. Thanks for posting! TC
     
  15. Detecto92

    Detecto92 Well-Known Member

    The Chinese have faking everything. Coins, apple products, antiques...and now metal detectors (for those who are in the hobby).

    I dunno about you, but if I had my way I would shut down every counterfeit operation in China and imprison everyone involved for a very long time. All counterfeiting does is hurt the hobby, and detract profits from fine and reputable American businesses.

    As heavy would say:
    [​IMG]
     
  16. model77

    model77 Silver Stacker

    UGH, where can you buy small orders and feel safe? I only get 1 or 2 oz at a time and I know my LCS will not catch this type of thing. They do not have knowledgeable collectors, it's a coin/card/jewerly place.

    When I was brand new I unwittingly sold them a couple clad bars at full spot. they said 200mils right on them. I did not know but I can't believe they didn't.

    Maybe generics are actually safer b/c they are less likely to be copied?
     
  17. pmbug

    pmbug Taking steps on my thousand mile journey

    Eagles are technically legal tender and subject to Secret Service investigations for counterfeiting claims. I believe this is why they generally carry higher premiums - less risk of counterfeits because counterfeiting carries more significant risk.
     
  18. medoraman

    medoraman Supporter! Supporter

    But so are coins and they are demonstrably being copied. I think the reason for premiums on ASE is two fold. One, they are coins and are collected by some, and two since you are familiar with the design its a little easier to have comfort in them.
     
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